Transporting Wurlitzer 2300

Hello,
New member here as well as new to jukeboxes. I've read the posts on here concerning transporting a jukebox and got some good information from that. I'm picking up a Wurlitzer 2300S tomorrow for a 2 hour drive back to my place. Unfortunately the only way to transport this is lying on it's back which I know is not ideal. I'm aware of the thumbscrews that need to be tightened to secure the carousel for transportation. Anything specific to the turntable and tone arm?
Thanks for any help,
jcjc

Unfortunately, the carousel mech is one of the least apt to be transported horizontally. Nonetheless, I move most of mine that way, so here are some suggestions:

-Remove the individual title holders. These can easily flop around.

-If yours still uses a 5U4 rectifier tube on the separate power supply (stereo machines) remove and pack outside the machine. Things can flop around and break it. It's not a bad idea to remove the 6973 tubes. They are somewhat sensitive to really rough handling.

-Make sure the junction box is bolted down. If this machine has a stepper (IIRC 1959 was the last year a stepper was standard) the plastic cover often has broken tabs, so if loose either tape it down or remove it.

-Check that the coin mech is firmly snapped shut.

-You may remove the valence fluorescent tube, or just put tape on the ends to prevent it falling out.

-There is a small, critical spring that provides the tracking pressure on the tonearm. I've read suggestions that it be removed, but unless the tonearm itself is taken out (not necessary here) there is no way for it to fall out.

----Lock and/or tape the dome glass shut.

Others may have something I failed to mention.

Admittedly, I've ignored these steps when circumstances and time didn't permit proper safeguards as I pulled them out of warehouses, garages and a barn, but after restoration I always followed the above procedures.

Plan on ordering-borrowing a service manual and rebuilding the amp.

Good luck.

Rob-NYC

A couple of things on that model that I can re-call--( hopefully you read all above tips---)
On the amplifier , as you look at it with the read door opened, there is a "retaining slider" that should be slud into it's groove, and locked with a small screw thru the hole. And although I agree with Rob on the tone arm spring--SOMEHOW, I have seen them "go missing" if the tone arm is not bound up ?--I use a "twist tie" there. Also--be SURE you take some "bailing wire"--lock the "thumb screws" with the wire so they can not loosen !! Good luck ! Ron Rich

Thanks very much for those great tips, gentlemen and I'll be sure to employ those. The machine I'm picking up tomorrow had a video taken within the last couple of days showing that it works. However I'm sure there are adjustments to be made, things to check, etc. I have downloaded the service manual for this machine but is there a troubleshooting guide anywhere and/or a "things to check when getting an old jukebox" guide? For example, something simple may get jarred out of adjustment on the trip home tomorrow and I'd probably have no idea where to look unless it's obvious. I own a few EM pinball machines so I'm familiar with many of the mechanisms but I'm definitely more of a right-brained guy when it comes to logic and trouble shooting.
I've also got a parts machine 2300 that initially was going to be one I was going to fix up until this other one surfaced. However, after researching and seeing the time it would take to get mine going, my unfamiliarity with these machines and what newly refurbished machines cost, it made sense to pick up a less-than-perfect working one now for a fair price and to be able to enjoy it in the near future.
Anyway, I'm looking forward to getting into this hobby and learning all I can. I've also found my grail machine which is an AMI Continental. I hear those are cheap and plentiful...
One last thing, I hear people complain about reliability and ease of repair work on Wurlitzers as being a pain. Can anyone comment on the validity of this or is this more of a personal preference thing?
Thanks much.

I found Dr Know It All's book on Wurlitzers Vol 2 so that should be a huge help.

All "Dr know it all's books" can be purchased at AlwaysJukin ( see above post).
As for "Adjustments"--IMHO, NONE are needed, if they are not "messed with". If something should appear to need adjusting, I try to find out why--it's usually a lack of proper lubrication or a part has failed, in which case, that failed item must be replaced prior to attempting "adjustments" --
One jukebox brand over the other, I think is subjective--I worked for Seeburg for years, and am more familiar with them, but WurliTzer and the others, also built good quality phonographs. Ron Rich

[quoteI hear people complain about reliability and ease of repair work on Wurlitzers as being a pain. Can anyone comment on the validity of this or is this more of a personal preference thing?][/quote]

As Ron points out, this is really a matter of personal experience and knowledge. By the mid-fifties Seeburg had adopted the toroidal memory system. Everyone else was still 'pins and coils" and it remained thus until the mid to late seventies when the other three builders went to microprocessor control and memory.

Even though the Tormat was -much- simpler than the mechanical memory systems there were people who -hated- Seeburgs because of it. I met several of these types in the late 60's and they were operators and in one case, a distributor of a competing brand.

It was no different than the TV repair people I met in the late 60's who wouldn't touch a color set. Some people develop a mental block and it keeps them from seeing that this is all just electronics.

The carousel mech that Wurlitzer developed in 1953 and used 'till the early 70's was by-far their best design. It is enormous compared to Seeburg and Rowe/AMI but is a personal favorite.

Problem spots are:

-Over time the indexing of the rockers (hammers) becomes a bit sloppy, the hammers to get wedged between two pins. Sometimes this can be dealt with by tightening-up the clearances of the nylon guide rollers that center the rocker-gear plate. My solution was to widen the hammers by placing aquarium airline hose around the ends of them.

-Excessive force used to pull down the lift arms. I do a careful alignment of the lift arm rollers to minimize friction and then just stretch-weaken the lift springs. I reduce the lift force from several pounds to approx 10-12 oz for the 200 mechs and 6-9oz for the 100-104.

-I am not wildly of how wurlitzer used the hard-stalled search motor to index the rockers. Eventually, this breaks the gear box, which, BTW should be oiled. Some people drill out the rivets, I prefer to make a 1/16 hole in one corner of the gearbox and insert a needle oiler.

-The DC mach motor will need to be taken apart for inspection of the commutator and to clean out all the accumulated carbon flakes from the brushes.

-There are leaf switches in the keyboard assembly that are a bit too weak for the purpose and must be re-formed slightly occasionally.

-The tonearm is a bit massive and has rather crude bearings...but...whatever.

-The keyboard-grill wash fluorescent lamp is a b---- to replace in that model. But again.....

If the machine has the original Sonotone pickup (8T or 8TA) -plan on replacing it. I always used a Pickering magnetic and added or built a preamp.

Rob-NYC

Hi Rob,
After reading your post, I just re-called--I gave up on replacing that grill wash lamp, on one of them, many years ago--Looked to me that at one time there were (about 1 million ?) thumb screws to remove/replace when servicing that lamp--This machine seemed to have had them ALL replaced with "regular screws", and my customer at that time, did not want to pay me to figure this out-- Is there an easier way to do this ?? Ron Rich

As for the lighting i'd probably keep the fixtures in there to keep it original but wire in some LED strips that mimic the color of the original fluorescent bulbs. they would last many times longer.
After a 6 hour round trip, I got the jukebox home. I followed the travel suggestions and everything went smoothly. the machine is pretty clean inside and has a couple of original factory paper tags and heat shields which is cool. I didn't realize how much stuff was actually missing from my parts machine now that I've seen what it supposed to contain inside. Fortunately the new machine is only missing (after a quick once over) the coin door, needle brush and the wurlitzer symbol at the top of the machine but the donor juke has all these parts. There is the typical upper left crack but it's only a hairline. At some point the rear half of each of the hinges was machined off and now the glass cover completely comes off. There's no more chance of doing more damage to that area and once the glass is back in place, it looks completely original.
After poking around inside and making sure nothing rattled loose , I put a dozen or so records in and played them all. Everything seemed to work and I was watching all the mechanisms as they did their thing. Really cool stuff. It doesn't sound half bad either. I fiddled with the bass a bit and it's pretty much how I remember the sound of types of record-playing jukes. The amp has been recapped but I'll likely still send it out for a going-through.
Couple of questions:
The reset button on the front. Is that so you can erase your selections? It doesn't do anything that I can tell but it's set on free play.
As it is, one press of the free play button allows one selection. Press it multiple times for multiple selections. Is there an adjustment on the coin mechs that allows the machine to give 5 selections with one press?
Thanks for the great tips Rob and Ron on things to look out for.

jcjc

The "reset button" functions only if one makes an error on the 1st button pushed. Say you press an "A", but wanted a "B". IF, you realize it prior to pushing a number button, you can push the reset, and the A button will pop up--
See your Service Manual ( you do have one ??) for price setting instructions --- Ron Rich

Hi Rob,
After reading your post, I just re-called--I gave up on replacing that grill wash lamp, on one of them, many years ago--Looked to me that at one time there were (about 1 million ?) thumb screws to remove/replace when servicing that lamp--This machine seemed to have had them ALL replaced with "regular screws",

They used four knurled screws with tall shoulders. I was able to remove those screws and slightly lift the section of the keyboard assembly to permit me to slide the tube out, but I can't remember if i finessed it under the keyboard harnesses and tipped it vertical. or unplugged the leads. I don't know how something like that got past the design stage. The 2400 used four, easily remove Phillips screws and you simply lift up the keyboard enough to clear the tube.

One point here is that fluorescent tubes used to last a LOT longer. I date all large parts I replace. Until about 16 years ago those larger tubes lasted at least 3-4 years. Now, even with Phillips brand, I see 1½ years -even though they are on 24hrs which substantially increases their life as opposed to frequent starts.

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As it is, one press of the free play button allows one selection. Press it multiple times for multiple selections. Is there an adjustment on the coin mechs that allows the machine to give 5 selections with one press?

JC, it seems like you have a dual pricing credit unit since the regular "Playrak" did not accumulate credit. I have one of those on a 2300S but the goofy way wurlitzer made it work was with a motor driving a pulse generator which stepped-up a credit wheel. The one I had was somewhat worn and erratic so I subbed a much simpler Rowe credit unit. If you want continuous free play, just jump the credit button on the inside of the keyboard assembly to ground.

Before doing much more I suggest checking --all-- fuses for correct values and a thorough lubrication with 20wt non-detergent oil. I use Mobil One nd.

Rob

Man, holding out on us with this little gem:

Over time the indexing of the rockers (hammers) becomes a bit sloppy, the hammers to get wedged between two pins. Sometimes this can be dealt with by tightening-up the clearances of the nylon guide rollers that center the rocker-gear plate. My solution was to widen the hammers by placing aquarium airline hose around the ends of them.

And then slipping it into an unrelated thread

I have noticed that the issue with the hammers; although it manifests itself (on my 2150) with a no-play. It is very, very infrequent at this point but I keep wondering if/when it will become more prevalent. My question about this approach is whether it may make the hammer so wide that it trips two pins?

Let me also concur with several of Rob's other points. Specifically, the force of the spring. I believe these springs were used on commercial buildings to lift 24 foot steel garage doors. Second, I've always maintained that hell for engineers involves having to maintain what they designed. I can tell you whoever designed that top fluorescent bulb has earned his/her place. After one particularly enjoyable session wrestling with that 'setup' (my wife said I sounded like the father of A Christmas Story repairing the furnace) I said to heck with it and put in led strips.

Brooks

Mine does have the dual pricing unit. I'm not sure what you mean by continuous free play though. Do you mean that there is no need to press the button? As in once the machine is on, I can just make my selections? That would be preferred but I'd still like to be able to add 5 selections at a time instead of having to press the button each time to add a credit. I looked through the owner's manual and perused the coin mech/pricing section but I didn't see specifically what I was looking for but that's likely because I'm still trying to understand it. So my ideal situation would be either a press of the add credit button yields 5 credits or it allows me to add songs (up to 5 total) w/o having to press the button-in other words, if two of the 5 songs have been played then I can just add two more selections.
First though is to lube everything as Rob suggested which for me means some disassembly will be required which then means I'll see another area that needs attention and on it goes. There's a fair amount of gunk buildup on the teeth of the rotating plate. Also when a record is being changed the noise of the motor(s) changes pitch like it's encountering some resistance. There's no detectable slowing down of the action that I can see but it seems something needs lubing/freeing up.

JC, here is a hot of the free play button on an 1800:
http://s1192.photobucket.com/user/Rob-N ... rt=2&o=222
For free play I just run a jumper with gator clips from one lead on the switch to the chassis next to it. One could replace the button with a toggle as well.

One question though in your case -and this is important; does the machine add additional credits each time the button is pressed. Or, does it just add a fixed quantity (5-?) each time it is pressed? If it adds one credit each time it is pressed the method I suggested will not be safe as it would leave the credit coils energized and blow the fuse or burn the coil out. I do think my mod would work, but you need to check to be sure the credit coil is not energized.

Also when a record is being changed the noise of the motor(s) changes pitch like it's encountering some resistance.

That is normal due to the fact that this is an unregulated motor.As it exerts force against the load it slows down since the is no feedback to increase current fed to it.

Rob

Man, holding out on us with this little gem:

Keeps things interesting, Brooks. Sort of like those old TV-movie serials.

As far as punching two pins at once, this will not happen unless your rocker plate is so out of tolerance that it would already be useless. I can't see a scenario where it could not be brought back into alignment at least well enough to use the hose-widened hammers.

At the risk of violating the "a little knowledge is dangerous" -credo, this might be a good time to wash the selector assemble since it would have to be partially disassembled anyway.

Rob