Ami WQ-200 wallbox blowing fuse...

The fuse keeps blowing out, after a while when my jukebox that is connected with the wallbox is turned on... maybe after 3-4 hours. any suggestions?

Maybe because the credit unit on the wall box gets stuck and does not cancel the credits? can it be that?
the fuse used is 0,5 amps slo blow, is it correct?

Hello straycat_gr,

Welcome to the forum.
We tend to like names and where you are located, the location helps because we are a worldwide forum and knowing which country you live in helps to direct you where to get parts or additional professional help.

I would check for a overheated lighting transformer in the wallbox or lamps that are the incorrect wattage fitted.
If you can rule these out then you can then fault find to a deeper level.

Regards
Alan

Alan Hood
ami-man
UK

Ok, the question that has to be answered is where is the fuse and what goes out when it blows. Typically those older electro-mechanical boxes draw upwards of 3 amp from the 24-28 volt AC line when they are sending but idles at only a fraction of an amp.

From what I recall, AMI used #47 lamps for the page and credit lights.

Rob-NYC

Hello Alan, I am sorry and I feel rude... you are right I should introduce myself before posting for the first time!
I am located in Athens Greece and am a proud owner of a AMI K 200 electrical (JAK200) 1960 model tha I managed to restore by myself (except the amp recaping process, cause my knowledge in electronics is kinda poor).
There is a stepper included in my model, so I paired it to the wq200 wallbox, I also recently restored.
You maybe right, it could be the transformer in the wallbox I will check it. but the lamps used are the #47 ones.
@Rob...
There is only 1 fuse in the specific wallbox and it should be 0,5 A as far as I know.
The weird part is that there is a strange noise coming from the credit unit I think (probably a coil) as soon as the fuse is blown out.
thank you both very much for the reply.
I will give some more feedback as soon as I figure out what it is.

Cheers to all,
Takis

Takis, the "strange noise" is the credit coil buzzing and pretty much confirms that coins are getting stuck at the coin switch and the fuse is doing what it should in protecting the credit coils.
First, the obvious, make sure the coin box is not backed-up with coins. Then you'll need to check that coins are falling through the validator fairly fast. Since you are using a different coinage than here in the U.S. I can't tell if they are lighter or not. Swing out the slug rejector magnets (on the validator) and see if the path is reasonably clean.

Every so-often I wash the validators I have in commercial service in a strong soap and hot water. use a small brush and perhaps a plastic scraper to remove any built up crud along the coin path. Rinse in hot water and blow dry with a vacuum used as blower or place it out in the sun to dry. A drop of oil on the bearing that opens the magnets when the rejector button is pressed is OK -but no oil on any of the coin cradles.

If cleaning the validator doesn't fix the problem, it is possible that the coin switch pivots are crudded-up. These are delicate and should not be touched unless absolutely necessary.

Rob-NYC

Hello Takis,

Are you saying that you get the strange noise from the credit unit after the fuse has blown? but not before?

Regards
Alan

Thanks Rob, your advice is very much apreciated and very useful. But Alan is right... the buzzing noise starts after the fuse gets blown, and that is a few hours after the wallbox is turned on (with my jukebox of course) and even if idle for all this time! it will become sudenly for no reason! Last night it woke me up after i had fell asleep watching a movie on my couch... I thought the house was collapsing in the silent of my nap!!!

which actually makes me think... shouldn't the blown out fuse cut the power of the coils also? :-/

AMI/Rowe used a rectifier and filter caps in their boxes -at least all those I've had, check the filter caps. If original or over 20 years old they probably need replacement. That sort of slow failure is consistent with capacitors that leak as they heat up.

Open the box and trace out where the fuse leads to and from. On the Rowe boxes that I use it only protects the coin coils.

Rob/NYC

Yes that was my latest conclusion too, I will replace the caps and let you know. thanks

Hello Takis,

I have just downloaded a copy of the WQ-200 wallbox off of the internet from the following site.
http://www.carlhaines.com/jukebox/manua ... Manual.pdf

The 1/2 amp fuse is in the AC supply line from the jukebox usually via a wall box transformer, we used to use and still stock the PL10B wallbox transformers that we used on the Rowe Ami Wallette wall boxes, these incorporate a relay in the AC Control line so that selections from each wall box & the jukebox can not effect each other (it delays the selection).

The fuse controls the transformer for the lights and feeds the coin finger switches and the credit coils (the paddle switches are open circuit, I usually set these with about 25 thou gap, spark plug gap) the fuse also controls the Motor Control Switch.

I think the sound you hear when the fuse blows is the movement of the motor control switch when the power drops out.
So my guess is that the transformer needs rewinding, this may be an option you need to consider.

Please let us know how you get on.

Regards
Alan

Alan Hood
ami-man
UK

Well, this has certainly taken an interesting turn.

First-off, thank you Alan for the schematic link.
What is interesting on that schematic is the use of AC throughout and no rectifier.

The two models I "inherited" from an op on tenth ave did have a selenium and two filters. After searching I've found what looks like the same types:

http://www.jukebox-world.de/Forum/Archiv/AMI/AMI_WQ.htm Scroll down. the use of DC in the box for credit and relays is similar to what I currently have in the WR series on location.

From what i was told back in 1988, when Rowe went to a speaker box (WRA-B-C) they issued a 12 conductor cable that was all 20ga. My two WR series locations have this cable and the drop is very noticeable when the box credits and steps-up. The added rect-filters were to provide enough sustained current to assure credit and step-up relay operation during that drop.

It seems that they could just have provided a better cable.

Rob/NYC

Hi Rob,

When we used to install these on site we used a cable with two larger cores and four data cores or ran a four core data and 1.5mm twin cable for the power.
On very long runs we even considered fitting a transformer near to the wallbox just to supply the 30 volts.

It was always a problem with taking over anyone elses cabling which was always the thin data cable only.

Regards
Alan

Alan Hood
ami-man
UK

Hello Alan and Rob for your replies, well here is my feedback...

Alan yes you were right, the sound is coming from the motor and not the credit coils!
And so I replaced the transformer, which seemed to solve the problem (till now). I did another

modification by adding a switch to my walbox power, so its not turned on if I dont want it with my

jukebox. I have left it up to 4 hours till now with no fuse blowing out... I think its solved, or maybe

because of the cold weather we have these days the transformer does not get too much heated....

well we'll soon find out

A weird thing I just found out is that I checked my other wallbox (I haven't restored yet, but works

fine) and is sort of different than this one, although it is the same model AMI WQ200...
What is weird is that this one does not have a credit unit similar to my jukebox's one. It has the one referred to the manual. It is a switch under the rotating wheel gear next to the motor! that was a big surprise to find out the other one has a seperate credit unit similar to my K200 ami jukebox.
Another major difference is the lack of the "rectifier" if I'm spelling it right, and the 2 big capacitors the other one has...will this be a problem???

Also missing the 2 of three pricing lights the other has, I guess because of a different pricing model. only has select light and wait light.

does anyone know about these issues?

Thanks alot for the help.

Alan, I had discovered that manual too with some search, but thanks very much for the sharing

Hello Takis,

I am glad to see that you have a solution to your problem, If you also use that other wallbox make sure you have a relay on the transformer for controlling the AC control line.

Regards
Alan

Alan Hood
ami-man
UK