Seeburg S100 does not scan

Hi all,

I just registered to this very nice board, glad to be here!
My name is Timo and I'm from Germany.

But now back to the Thread's topic

Just got a very good occasion and bought a Seeburg S100 in a non working condition.
I am an electronics engineer and have some knowledge in mechanics so I thought this would be a nice hobby to refurbish it.

The issue with the box is that it does not scan at all.
I already did lube the mechanics at all the points I could reach as long as everything is still assembled and cleaned the switching contacts on the Select-O-Matic, the SPU and the Control-Center.
I also checked for optically bad caps same as solder connections and cleant the connectors.

Now what's working already is:
If I enter a coin and make an entry to the keyboard the motor only starts running. If I then release the detent lever it gabs the record from the slot the carriage is currently linked to.
It also plays it, the sound is good and once it comes to the end of the record it also rejects the record correctly.
Also if I push the reverse switch it then plays the other side of the record in the same above way.

So my problem is that it does not scan at all, the carriage does not move.
Now my idea is that it could be caused by a trapped clutch.
I was not yet able to thoroughly inspect it, because I did not yet find the time to disassemble the mechanics.

My question:
Before I remove the mechanics from the cabinet for inspection of the clutch and so on, what else do you think could be causing this trouble, that could be inspected while the mechanics are still inside the cabinet?

My problem also is that I at the moment only own the service guides for the Tormat and the Select-O-Matic, but not yet the S100-specific manuals.
Where would you recommend me to buy this?

Many thanks in advance for your help!
And I have to say this is a nice board with many enthusiasts. I was already reading here for many hours and learned a lot!


Greetz, Timo

Hi Timo,
You are nearly correct-- it would be my GUESS that you have a "stuck"/"sticking", slow, safety plunger..
You might try the following to clear it: Turn the motor off as it is playing a record. push the reject switch and the detent lever should pop up,
At that point, turn the motor coupler BY HAND, ( this allows more time for the safety lever spring to push the pin out of the record and clutch dog link, path). If properly oiled, and not binding the clutch should fall into the scan position,
Sources for books/parts are listed above in Announcements-stickies section of this, the jukebox section--go to "home", "Jukeboxes", and scroll down to "Used-new parts/books--"
Ron Rich

Hi Ron,

many thanks for your help!
Appreciate that very much

Well understood what you like me to try out.
I should have some spare time tomorrow afternoon.

Would be great if it only was some stuck mechanics.
According to seller the box was running very smoothly until this issue showed up in the beginning of this year.
So I expect the tormat is still adjusted correctly and in good shape, no other issues to be expected.

We 'll see....


Greetz, Timo

Hi Ron, hi all

just did as you supposed me to.
Everything worked as you expected, the detent lever sprung up when I pushed the trip switch (it is a reed contact so I pushed it by manually moving the tone arm).

But hell no, the mechanics did NOT switch over to scan mode at all.
I could reach the plunger on the behind of the carriage with two fingers.
I checked it and it is not really moving very freely. If I move it a few millimeters it stays in this position.

So I would assume the plunger is causing the issues, right?
What is next, do I need to remove the whole mechanics from the cabinet in order to reach the plunger properly or is it possible to remove the carriage only OR would it even be possible to fix that while still being assembled?

The good thing:
The whole mechanics is now moving very freely, it was easy to move the motor by hand, only at the time the reject process of the record started, it needed some more force, which I think should be okay due to the mechanics doing a lot of stuff at this moment.

Greetz, T

Udate:

The plunger is now moving freely.
The clutch yoke lever and detent arm there were quite clogged, managed to free them up so far, too.

Then following your by-hand sequence I finally managed to get the mech into scan mode.
Then made entries to the keyboard and it chose some "random slot" and played it over and over again.
Before choosing a slot it did not move to any end position, neither left nor right, strange...
Okay, should be caused by the mech still being too slow, isn't it?
So this assy needs to be cleant and lubed more thoroughly.

Now then I moved the carriage to the utmost right position.
Fired up the box again, but inside the SPU some solenoid is noisy.
The carriage won't move, the plunger is locking the record slot and the clutch link is keeping it in this position.

Any ideas??

Greetz!

Yep--lots of "ideas"--Your "buzzing is because the mechanism is sitting in the position that holds the scan subtract coil energized--not the normal position for the mech--you will again need to move it by hand!---do not leave it powered up, as that coil will melt !!!
Also, yes, you still have clutch, and or safety pin problems ( I would humbly suggest that my 'Seeburg Mechanism Guide" should help you).
Ron Rich

Hi Ron,

yes, I did power the cab down immediately, was also clear to me that this is not a normal condition.
And yes, I will order this guide within today, already had this in mind, thanks!

Ok, carriage is free now and the switching between playing and scanning now works.
The box is now playing record quite randomly.
It started moving from right position to the left, somtimes picking the next record, sometimes skipping some slots and then grabbing the next one.
Now it reached the outer left position and proceeds with this randomplay back to the right side, but the other side of the record, so war so good!
The clutch is always engaging now so that is working.

Now what is this strange randomplay being caused by?
Do I now need to put focus on tormat and keyboard?

Greetings,
Timo

Update:

The box is fully working again!

So cool!!!

Many thanks Ron for your support.
I will anyways buy the book to be prepared for next issues, which indeed I hope there won't any

Greetz, Timo

Hi Timo,
What did you do ?? Did you just allow it to play all the selections that someone made previously, or did you find something wrong ?
Ron Rich

Hi Ron,

exactly.
It just came back to my mind how the tormat memory works and that it does not loose its content as it is stored in a magnetic way.

So I just emptied the slots, let the box choose whatever it liked to and always moved the tone arm immediately to trigger the reject.
It nearly played every slot!
Then it came back to life.

We now had the juke playing records for two hours without issues, all good...

Finally a good recommendation for the German users on a very good oil, that can be obtained locally:
Use Ballistol!
It is a natural oil compound with outstanding lubricating capabilities. So contains no components from mineral oil that can clog the mechanics.
Did a great job here


Ron, thanks again and best wishes,
Timo

Hi all,

one more question from my side.

The juke is currently acting like the following and I am not 100% sure, if that is correct:

Say I enter a coin for 2 credits and make a selection for B5. Then the carriage starts from around K3, moves to the left, selects the correct record and plays it.
Now while it is doing that I make a selection for A3.
However after completing and rejecting B5 the carriage moves to the outer right again, hits the switch for the substract coil, turns to the left and stops near K3 again.
But the selection of A3 was stored to the tormat correctly.
So once I enter another coin and make a selection it then also plays A3.

In a nutshell:
Write-in is working correctly,but the carriage only selects records, I stored before it came along the corresponing slot while anyways only moving one time from the right to the left and back.

Normal behaviour or not?


Greetz, T

Hi Timo,
No--not "normal"--either one of two things is happening here--either the scan control "add" is not adding two scans, or the scan control subtract, is subtracting two scans at once. The thing I can't recall with out further info, is which type scan control assembly was used in that model-tell me which type pricing unit is installed, so I can determine that--Ron Rich

Hi Ron,

It is a SPU 4-56.

Thanks, Timo

OK--Code A or, Code B ?

I will check this today after work.
Hope I can still find some marking...

Thx, Timo