Rock-ola 464 plays randomly, but doesn't process selections

Okay. I took the magazine motor apart and cleaned and lubed it. Pics are linked below. Hopefully I got the washers back in the correct position. If I didn't, please let me know.

http://imageshack.com/a/img913/3778/8vE3f7.jpg
http://imageshack.com/a/img537/633/UeGet9.jpg
http://imageshack.com/a/img674/6381/2z4U1Q.jpg
http://imageshack.com/a/img674/1582/MSZEik.jpg

Don't know what you mean by "motor--turn freely"--If not installed you should feel no resistance, when turning the knurled post. Did you oil the bearings on the magazine, with 20 wt. oil ??
On the "green wire"--that appears to be a "static ground" to me-- not in any circuit -- and--IMHO, Deoxit is not what one should use to "wash" anything--You need to dis-assemble that hammer coil/spring assembly and clean it well--Do NOT oil it !
Ron Rich

When you had the motor apart--didja check/oil the two bearing races, clean the armature ? At least spread the grease around ( if not change it) ??
I too hope you put the parts back correctly, 'cause iffin you didn't, it ain't gonna so good, work !
Ron Rich

The only thing I'm worried about not putting back right are the washers. I had them in order but due to carbon and slickness the smaller ones stuck together and when I pulled them apart they separated on my fingers to where I couldn't tell how they were placed with each other. I believe the thinnest ones were closest to the copper wires and larger ones were after them. The grease that was on the gears had congealed slightly but with just a few drops of 20 wt. it was good. I followed some of the info and your wisdom from this post and some from what I found on google:

http://www.phonoland.com/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=5763&hilit=rock+ola+gripper+motor+washers

Did you look at the pictures I included? Those were taken after I cleaned it. I brushed off the carbon and cleaned the parts with solvent (minus the copper wires. They were only brushed off). I put oil down the part of the shaft (screw-like) that connects to the gears. The bearings were sandwiched between the washers, correct? Yes I oiled them as well. I believe it's ready for a test run if someone will verify my washers or confirm they "look right". I searched for an hour last night for a schematic of the motor, but my search was fruitless. I'll start in on the read-out hammers tonight. You're wanting me to clean the whole arm and hammers and remove it from the shaft, right? Wipers and all.

On the "shim washers"--I doubt it makes much, if any, difference how they are assembled--all that counts is total thickness--
Ron Rich

Thanks Ron. I'll go give'r a shot!

I need to get a pressure gauge to put the read-out arm back on if I take it off. What kind of pressure gauge do I need?

I hooked up the magazine motor and it worked like a charm. The voltage drop is still there. 31 V without the motor plugged in and roughly 28 V with it plugged in and not mounted. I knew it wasn't gunked up that bad.

I did oil everything I could get to without disassembling anything on the carriage. I wish I had another jukebox to compare the "freeness" to when I turn it by hand, but the records are pretty heavy so I think it's moving pretty good. I'll hook the motor back up and read the voltage later.

I went back and re-read what you told me about the hammer coils and you told me only to clean the coils and hammers (no oil) by disassembling them so I'll try it without removing the read-out arm.

I'm in big doo-doo now. I put the magazine motor back in. Turned it on and hit the scan lever but the magazine didn't move so I loosened the bolts a little. (they were a little loose when I first removed it) I hit the scan lever and the magazine started moving. I then entered a selection and it played it. I hit the scan lever again and the magazine didn't move and heard the motor whining. I killed power and went to adjust the motor. I had to move the magazine a little which I assume knocked everything out of sync since it hadn't returned the record and now the cb trips the moment I reset it. How do I fix this? Take the motor off and try to get the carriage back in the right place? Or did I do something worse?

Update:
I was right about what was kicking the cb. I loosened the motor and rotated the magazine by hand to the selection it was playing and got it to play records again. I hit the scan lever and heard the whining sound again. So I stopped and took the motor off so I could watch it when I hit the scan lever. The gear wasn't turning so I must have done something wrong in reassembly or cleaning. Hopefully I didn't do any permanent damage. The knurled knob still turned the magazine carriage because that was how I adjusted it to keep the cb from tripping. I didn't think that it turned both ways before, but maybe it did. I'm taking it apart again to see what failed. Funny how it worked for about 5 minutes.

Update 2 the update:

I opened it up and didn't find anything obvious. Some oil from the bearings was on the brushes so I took a paper towel and wiped everything down. Put it back together to test it and when I tried I couldn't get the cb to reset. I unplugged the motor and looked at the carriage. It might have moved a little so I lined it up hoping it would work like the last time. Unfortunately when I pushed the cb in nothing happened other than the speakers were unmuted for brief instance. What have I done to it now? The motor's not tripping it because it's not even plugged in. I probably won't sleep well tonight. I rarely do when I have an epic fail or if I've made things worse.

I've been told I'm spending too much time trying to fix her jukebox by my mom's other caregivers, but I'm stubborn as you can tell. I know eventually I'll be able to fix it with everyone's help, but I might have to limit my time on it to 2 hours a week. I hate setbacks.

If I take the gripper motor off and turn the gears by hand to move the gripper arm over the magazine do you think that will keep the cb from tripping?

At this point--I have no ideas-- Ron Rich

It's that bad, huh? I think it's just like when the gripper arm froze on me. The cb did the same thing. The record is still on the turntable and the tonearm is on the record. I don't have anything to lose. Worse case scenario is I start gutting it and sell it for parts and get my mom a new one.

The reason I took the motor apart is because it started tripping the cb again when scanning and the voltage would dip down to 22 V which might not be enough to make the coils fire. Voltage at the coil wire was reading in the 27-28 V range without the resistance of the magazine when the motor ran by itself and 22V with resistance. I know it's a 22 V motor with a ceramic capacitor soldered on the connecting wire. If the cap is bad that might also be the reason for the drain or one in the PS could be the culprit. I found this when searching the web:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3ZSRitHA5Qc

Published on Apr 26, 2013

Here is a Rockola 470 playing after repairs. Some minor issues like fixing the hanging light circuit board to be done but it's playing. The main problem was failure to cancel pins consistently even after cleaning every contact. The clue was the -33 mech voltage which the hammer coils run off was only 22 volts. A filter capacitor in the power supply was open. The gripper and basket motors run faster too.And a hum from the speakers I thought was from the amp is gone too.

I don't remember if the tone arm returns when moving the gripper manually, but I think I should try that before giving up. I know I'm an annoyance, but I'm not doing this for me. I was told the box had no problems, but it has had at least 6 issues and half of them have been resolved. This new issue I created.

If anyone has any other ideas please let me know.

I used the knurled end of the gripper motor to place the record back in the magazine and move the gripper arm over it. The cb still behaves the same. I tested the three fuses on the outside of the panels for continuity, but I need to find my fuse puller to test the ones inside the main power box. I must have damaged something, but the magazine motor never tripped the cb when it was operating, and it was tested for two to three minutes so I could get my readings. It was tested for close to two minutes in operation once I bolted it back on. The red spring button on the mech cb has been a little sticky. Is it possible my cb is wore out? Hopefully I will hear from others and those who have helped in the past as well: Jimmler, clones, Juke-rocks, Psychman, and mb9513. Sorry if I missed anyone.

Ron Rich wrote:At this point--I have no ideas-- Ron Rich

Aww, Ronnie!

My stubbornness prevailed. It's running again. I had a loose connection to the turntable/mech power (red connector). It was connected, just not very good which made it easy to overlook when searching for something obvious. I ran the magazine motor for 7 minutes, but there is an intermittent vibration/ knock in it. I'll take it apart again and see if it's a washer that didn't seat well. I'm getting 27.7 V when I test voltage at ms 2A and 2 when it's running.

Congrats !!
"Stubbornness" IS a virtue--sometimes--- my dog is stubborn at times also--!
On the "vibration"--did you change the three motor mounts ? IMHO, the only ones to use, that will not allow motor "vibration to leak through", are the original white (or, off white), type-- Ron Rich