seeburg STD4 progress - still more to do

First post here, so please be gentle. I've been having issues with my mardi gras for years now and must admit to having got close to giving up. I live in the UK, but was on vacation in the US, so had Ron's troubleshooting guide, an amp cap kit, new needles as well as some other parts from a guy in Idaho on ebay delivered to my vacation hosts.
I have now solved the following
Makes no selections - Ron's guide on cleaning up keypad.
No volume, replaced trip relay in amp (only had 12v out of the amp I bought in the US and not 24v as original, seems to have been muted all the time. Is the 12v/24v relay going to be a going to be a problem, seems fine.
Reliably plays the selection chosen. Lots of cleaning, lubing and adjusting.
Wouldn't reject apart from with the mechanical lever. Cam switch problems.
However one problem remains. It insists on repeating the same selection ad infinitum, unless the mains is switched off and on. According to most sources this is the safety plunger, but it seems to move fully out of the way. I've made a video of it playing 179 with no disc in the slot.and if that helps I could post it. I made the same video after switching the mains so it does move on and the big difference is the clutch link only moves down about half an inch when it repeats, but moves fully down after switchingt the mains off and back on so the mech moves on to the next disc.
All suggestions welcome - thanks

Hi, and thanks for purchasing my Guide !
(I do sell/ship it directly, world-wide).
A 24 not 12 volt dc relay must be used in the amp. Since it is on continuously, a 12 volt unit will likely catch fire !
Also--the amp relay MUST be "adjusted" as per my Seeburg Trouble Shooting Guide amp notes.
Watch the relay on the DCC while it picks up a record--it should relax prior to the needle hitting the record. If it does not, check the 3M1 contacts, and look at the schematic for the DCC the you are using--look for the relay hold contacts, and clean them if the 3M1's are good.
Ron Rich

Ron Rich wrote:Hi, and thanks for purchasing my Guide !
(I do sell/ship it directly, world-wide).
A 24 not 12 volt dc relay must be used in the amp. Since it is on continuously, a 12 volt unit will likely catch fire !
Also--the amp relay MUST be "adjusted" as per my Seeburg Trouble Shooting Guide amp notes.
Watch the relay on the DCC while it picks up a record--it should relax prior to the needle hitting the record. If it does not, check the 3M1 contacts, and look at the schematic for the DCC the you are using--look for the relay hold contacts, and clean them if the 3M1's are good.
Ron Rich

Thanks Ron,
Ah, must sort the amp relay then. I've tried a spare 24v relay in the dcc and it made no difference. is it possible to use the 24v DCC relay in the amp by adjusting the contacts to make sure the two end pins make contact first?
Might it be a clutch issue and would sharing the two videos be of any help diagnosing the issue?

Sure--the 24 vdc relay can be "adjusted"--
The 12 vdc relay may be used in the DCC, if you add a 150 ohm, 2 W.ww, in series with the coil +27vdc supply. ( If you have a DCC -2 Code B, or any DCC-3, this was done as they used 12 vdc relays).
Did you watch the relay operate--what did it do-not do ?
Ron Rich

Ron Rich wrote:Sure--the 24 vdc relay can be "adjusted"--
The 12 vdc relay may be used in the DCC, if you add a 150 ohm, 2 W.ww, in series with the coil +27vdc supply. ( If you have a DCC -2 Code B, or any DCC-3, this was done as they used 12 vdc relays).
Did you watch the relay operate--what did it do-not do ?
Ron Rich

The DCC relay doesn't seem to be doing the right thing. After switching mains off and on, the relay is relaxed (not energised), just prior to play the relay energises and stays that way. When reject is pressed the relay stays energised throughout the cycle of the disc leaving the turntable and the same disc returning. If I knock the mains off during play the relay obviously relaxes and stays that way once mains is back on and the disc playing. When the carriage moves on to select a disc ( because mains has been off/on) the relay once more energises as play starts and remains that way.

blythpower wrote:

Ron Rich wrote:Sure--the 24 vdc relay can be "adjusted"--
The 12 vdc relay may be used in the DCC, if you add a 150 ohm, 2 W.ww, in series with the coil +27vdc supply. ( If you have a DCC -2 Code B, or any DCC-3, this was done as they used 12 vdc relays).
Did you watch the relay operate--what did it do-not do ?
Ron Rich

The DCC relay doesn't seem to be doing the right thing. After switching mains off and on, the relay is relaxed (not energised), just prior to play the relay energises and stays that way. When reject is pressed the relay stays energised throughout the cycle of the disc leaving the turntable and the same disc returning. If I knock the mains off during play the relay obviously relaxes and stays that way once mains is back on and the disc playing. When the carriage moves on to select a disc ( because mains has been off/on) the relay once more energises as play starts and remains that way.

Sorry, forgot to add mine is a DCC4 code A and had a 24v relay fitted

The relay, from what you have written is NOT doing the right thing--- It is indicating that either the 3M-1 contacts are not "making", or "opening" , or the "relay hold" contacts are not making/breaking. Did you clean/analog meter check, them ( read above sticky post on "how to clean") ? If clean and working properly ( also check contacts in relay socket !), this would indicate a faulty SCS circuit ( which is extremely rare !). Ron Rich

Ron Rich wrote:The relay, from what you have written is NOT doing the right thing--- It is indicating that either the 3M-1 contacts are not "making", or "opening" , or the "relay hold" contacts are not making/breaking. Did you clean/analog meter check, them ( read above sticky post on "how to clean") ? If clean and working properly ( also check contacts in relay socket !), this would indicate a faulty SCS circuit ( which is extremely rare !). Ron Rich

Thanks again Ron,
I've tried a spare relay which made no difference, so that probably takes away a problem with the relay contacts and I'm going to be away for a couple of weeks, so won't be able to check those things till then, but will get back to you as soon as I can.

Have had a chance to have a quick look before I leave. 3M1 is open during play and closed when carriage scans and is at rest. It closes briefly when rejecting and resuming the same disc.

Hopefully, you will see this first--apparently contact numbering is different on the manual I looked at, vs the one you have looked at--
The contact that is "relay hold" is the lowest one on the upper large stack --under the actuator arm, --closed at all times, except when phono is in play position. Ron Rich