Rock-Ola 496-1 problem/issue

Hi everybody!

First, I'm new to this site. I found your group by trying o search for info to help me diagnose a Jukebox I just bought. When I couldn't find the solution anywhere, I thought I would try to post my specific situation and see if that might help me solve this. Here goes.

A couple days ago, I bought a 1988 Rock-Ola 496-1 and I need some guidance/wisdom on how to make it operational. Cosmetically it looks great. Mechanically it has some issues. Here are what I've observed and what I've done:

Bought a set of manuals for this model (System 3 operating manual, Service Manual-Mechanism & Amplifier Adjustments, Domestic & Export Wiring Diagram (schematics), Parts Catalog and Pricing Procedure). What you don't know CAN hurt you.

When it is powered up, everything lights up and both the magazine and the turntable immediately start turning..........and never stop. Note: the Magazine has roughly 90 records.

If I move the scan switch from 'Operate' to the 'OFF' position they both stop. If I move the switch to Scan', the magazine rotates until I move it back to 'OFF'.

Each time the magazine completes a full rotation, I hear a mechanical click as if it's finishing, but it just continues rotating.

The opto LED is flashing and the front display shows that it's counting records.

I found what appears to be the volume pot hanging loose. There were two wires connected to it (red & black if memory serves) and a third wire not connected but could have possibly been at one time (orange w/black trace).

There is no cd player installed and no input cable plugged into the designated CD connector on the logic board (the main board on the left hand rear wall).

It was suggested to me that the 3.6V NiCad battery on the System 3 board might be a possible cause. with the power cord unplugged, I removed the circuit board from the juke. A thorough visual inspection showed that the battery was original and (thankfully) had not leaked. A voltmeter showed a reading of 0.16V. Definitely no longer working. I bought a 3.6V 600mAh 3x AA NiCad battery pack and soldered it to the board. I installed a 2-position connector so that the battery pack may be replaced without having to solder anything to the board. With the battery now located away from the board (and any other electronics) a battery leak is no longer a threat. Regrettably, this did not solve my problem.

I put the System 3 board into 'Test Mode'. I pressed the button for "Test Once". Nothing happened. I manually tripped a switch (that had a roller-tipped arm) located on the front, right-hand side of the phonograph. This made the carousel stop and the gripper arm moved to pick up a record but came up empty. NOTE: Startled that something was actually happening I failed to notice if the gripper had tried to get a record from an empty slot.

The arm moved to place the phantom record on the turntable. As it rotated to put the correct side of the record down, I saw that the gripper arm actually physically contacted the turntable enough to momentarily make it stop turning. This can't be good.

With the test completed, the magazine resumed its endless rotations, but with one significant change. As it turned, I would hear a noise from the magazine like a record snapping against something. I couldn't see anything, but when I stopped the magazine to remove all the records, I saw that many of them had pieces broken off. Like small 1/4 to 1/2 inch bites.

At this point, I had to stop my investigation. The gripper arm incident and the broken records tell me that I need to go through all the mechanical components and adjust them to factory specifications.

That's about all the info I can think of. I apologize for being so long-winded, but I wanted to provide all the information I have to aid diagnosis.

My questions are:

Could the fact that the machine is out of adjustment be the cause of the magazine's endless rotation?

Are there specific areas that I should be looking into to solve this?

Any suggestions and/or advice would be greatly appreciated.

Thank you in advance!
Steve

I am not familiar with system 3, but it appears that you may have some computer problems. Try re-setting any socketed chips in it---
I would advise yo not to "make any mechanical adjustments" until after you oil that gripper assembly properly, and operate it at least 100 times. The graphite grease used by RockOla in those tends to stiffen, but can be revived with 20 wt. ND oil. In my experience, I have found "other stuff" to be quicker at freeing it up--but the "other stuff" ALWAYS dried out very quickly.
Look thru some of the posts here--there are a lot of them on this subject--
Ron Rich

Steve: regarding the broken records: the carousel needs to be fully loaded (balanced evenly) with all 100 records so that the band that holds the records in place can do its job properly. If the records aren't loaded evenly, they will slide out a bit as the magazine rotates and get clipped off on the steel frame as it goes around. There is an adjustment in the service & adjustments manual for the 496 but it's rarely necessary to make that adjustment.
Be sure to free up the gripper assembly as Ron has instructed. As-found, those are usually bound up and nothing works right until the gripper moves freely. If you've not already done so, carefully clean all the contacts between the S3, keyboard, and the mech power board; and between the mech power board and the power supply. Try re-seating the two relays on the mech power board. You should be able to hear the one soldered inside the power supply operate. Observe the microswitch up front to see if the notched position seems to be where the drawing in the service & adjustments manual shows it for different stages of the cycle, and clean those connections, too. Good luck. The 496 has a great sound. Hope you hear yours soon.
Patrick

Patrick,
Thanks for that info on an unbalanced RO basket--I have never dealt with that before, but sure can envision how it could happen !
Rowe's with an unbalanced basket, tend to play the wrong selection--- Ron Rich

I'm trying to make this Rockola 496-1 functional, but I'm not having much in the way of success. Perhaps if I share what I've done so far, someone here might have an idea of what I should try next.

To recap, when you power up the juke, the S3 board initializes and the "Normal Operation" LED lights, but both the magazine and the turntable begin to rotate continuously.

The first thing I did to try to solve this was to remove the System 3 board and remove the 3.6V NiCad battery. Luckily it hadn't leaked yet! I replaced it with a remotely located cordless phone battery with the same specifications.

No change; problem continues.

Today, I removed the S3 board and removed/reseated all the IC chips. I also carefully cleaned the edge connectors on the board with "Big Bath" contact cleaner. I reinstalled the board, but to my horror, it wouldn't even boot! Close investigation revealed that one leg of one board was outside the socket. After i addressed this, the system powered up properly, but the original problem continued.

I see that the tip of the gripper arm is not resting in the outer "V" rest (I don't remember the proper term). I also noticed that the large gears behind what I think is the tone arm cam look like they do not mesh properly, but having never seen a properly working 496, I could be wrong. I added a picture of the gears, if that helps.

As I mentioned in my thread, the one time I was able to make the gripper move through it's cycle, the gripper arm actually contacted the turntable platter. Based on everything, I think the gripper is out of whack. I can't get the gripper to move manually so I am pretty positive all the old grease has turned to glue. I would like to disassemble the gripper assembly to properly clean, lubricate and adjust, but I hit a wall after removing the tone arm assembly.

I have a set of manuals and schematics for this model, but it isn't much help to be honest. The parts catalog is somewhat helpful, but I'm not finding the diagnostic info I thought I would find in these manuals.

I don't want to make things worse by breaking something or disassembling it to the point where I'm in over my head.

If anyone has any guidance/suggestions they could send my way, I would sure appreciate it.

Steve,
Gripper looks OK to me as far as I can see- didja look thru the RockOla gripper posts on the forum, like I suggested earlier ?
Ron Rich

Yeah, Ron, I did a search for 496 gripper info, but it was not fruitful. Were all of Rockola's grippers the same? Maybe I'm being too specific.

Yep--RockOla used the same basic "gripper" thru all their phono's from the 50's on up to the CD's, which were just modified to handle CD's-- Ron Rich

OK, I am heavily involved in a crash course education on Rockola Gripper assemblies. I am slowly overcoming my fears of doing more harm than good. what I have accomplished since my last update:
I have :

• Disassembled the gripper mechanism

• Removed every trace of what was once a grease/lubricant.

• Re-lubricated all parts and contact surfaces using special grease I had on hand that I bought for use on a couple Electro Mechanical games I have (note. If this grease does not work out, I'll disassemble the mech and use the 20W ND oil that's been recommended)

• Reassembled the gripper assembly.

Although the gripper assembly now moves freely, the problem continues.

By manually turning the knurled knob on the gripper motor, I am able to move the gripper through it's cycle. As I turn the knob,It 'grips' a record, lifts it out of the magazine and continues on it's arc until the gripper arm contacts the turntable! That's right, the gripper arm doesn't want to rotate the record to either the 'A' or 'B' side. I can physically make the gripper flip the record, but not if I am turning the motor knob

I don't know if this is somehow the root cause of my problem but regardless, why would the gripper act like this? There are no missing parts to the gripper assembly. Additionally, none of the parts seem worn.

I am enjoying the education I am receiving at Rockola University, this latest revelation is rather frustrating. Between yesterday and today, I have worked over 10-12 hours. My awesome wife's patience at my leaving her alone for a good portion of Labor Day Weekend while I work in the basement is amazing. But I'm sure there's a limit to it and I hope I can get this baby up and running before it wears out.

Any ideas/suggestions? Is this common to Rockolas?

As always, any and all help will be gratefully appreciated!

Thanks,
Steve

Hi Steve,
If the arch of the gripper is hitting the TT, it would suggest that the pin that flips it one way or the other is broken off/missing ?
This, along with the AB switch on OLDER RockOla's, is regulated by the cam follower--don't remember if it was still the same on this model, or not-- Ron Rich

For the life of me, Ron, based on observation and the parts diagram I don't see where there are any parts missing or broken. That being said, I could be totally wrong. Obviously, there's something wrong. I don't see a physical mechanism that 'flips' the record. The one time I was able to get the gripper to cycle, the gripper did flip the record BUT the gripper arm did hit the turntable.

Thank you, Ron, for replying and trying to help. I appreciate it very much!

Steve

Hi Steve,
Since I basically don't have any idea of what I'm talking about--just convoluted memories of how "grippers,in general" work, I am having a difficult time with this-- It seems to me that when the gripper gets about mid way up with the record the rear of the gripper slides into a notch, that can be ( and is) "flipped" in either direction. The direction of this guide, is what turns the gripper in the direction needed--I am guessing that somehow ( altho I can't visualize how) the "cut-out" in the rear of the gripper is missing that guide totally ?
I assume you have the correct service manual ---
Does this model still have an AB switch ?
Ron Rich

Steve: Great to see that your S3 appears to be working. The gripper striking the turntable is usually due to sticking parts, but you mentioned disassembling the gripper mech. Did you remove the two gears? Timing their position on reassembly is critical and in my experience, difficult; even with a similar mechanism nearby to reference. If you disengage the driving gear on the gripper motor, you should be able to move the gripper freely through its cycle.
When you get past this, check your microswitch and its contacts with the info provided in this forum. Th 496 has a simplified microswitch / cam assembly, but it's still in charge of which motor runs and when.
Patrick

It's funny that you mention timing, Patrick. Yes, I had to remove both gears as part of the disassembly process. During reassembly, I was able to install the gears back into the exact position they were in previously. But now as I think about it, they might have been in wrong before I ever touched it. I actually had to manipulate the gripper arm to get the gears back into their 'original' orientation.

My adjustment manual doesn't provide any information on how to time the gripper gears or any microswitch adjustments. I haven't found any info here on how this is accomplished. Can you shed some light on this?

I woke up at 2:00AM this morning thinking about what I could do to fix this. You've given me a new direction to consider.

Thank you for your help, Patrick!

Ron Rich wrote:Hi Steve,
Since I basically don't have any idea of what I'm talking about--just convoluted memories of how "grippers,in general" work, I am having a difficult time with this-- It seems to me that when the gripper gets about mid way up with the record the rear of the gripper slides into a notch, that can be ( and is) "flipped" in either direction. The direction of this guide, is what turns the gripper in the direction needed--I am guessing that somehow ( altho I can't visualize how) the "cut-out" in the rear of the gripper is missing that guide totally ?
I assume you have the correct service manual ---
Does this model still have an AB switch ?
Ron Rich

All the literature I have is for the 496-1 and 496-2 (Mine is a 496-1).

Here is an exploded view of a Rockola Gripper Assembly I found on Flipper.com. It's not exactly like mine, but is close enough for what I'm going to explain.

There is a part on the gripper that looks like a 60's Peace sign called the Gripper Arm Reversing Cam (13). I think that is what 'flips' the record to either the a or B side as it engages the Gripper Reversing Bracket Assembly (9). If am manually move the gripper through it's cycle, the reversing cam does not engage the pins on the reversing Bracket.

I don't know if this helps, but when the scan switch is in the Operate position, causing the magazine and TT to turn continuously, I notice that as the magazine completes one rotation, the reversing bracket changes position. When the magazine completes it's next rotation, the bracket changes to its second position. This continues endlessly.

Does any of this make sense?