Astro-Sonic 100

Hey Folks,

Someone emailed me yesterday evening (it's about 5:15am here in Tucson) about a 1966 Astro-Sonic 100 "Francisco" that he acquired. He's gonna do a complete restoration on it and gutted all the components. He's an engineer and knows his way around electronics, so his recapping/whatever issues will not be a problem.

Anyhoo, he showed me the pics of all the pieces he removed, and I was shocked to see that his model has FOUR horns and woofers with 6" square magnets. The woofers are sorta encased/separated in their own open back chamber, not the sealed styrofoam things. I've never seen magnets so large, and these are not the Super-Sonic woofers featured in a 1966 brochure, the ones he has are much larger.

Could he actually have some type of IMPERIAL, or did Magnavox double-up on horns in some of their regular 100's? Could it be one of those 150-watt Imperials touted over on Magnavoxfriends? Believe it or not, I don't know that much about Magnavox other than my obsession with them.

I have two of these units. The one in the living room has the newer W620 changer, while the one in the garage has an older, possibly W608, changer with different knobs on the receiver and a reel-to-reel tape deck with microphones and owners manual. The one in the living room has dark front center drawers, while the other one is all the same finish. I have not removed the backs of either to see what's in them, but at least they'r purty.

What kind of beast does he have? The first pic is my older unit out in the garage, but the other two pics are his. I'll eventually get around to removing the back panels on my two to see what's up in there. --BB

Bobby Basham
Tucson, Arizona

Hi Bobby,
As you know, I know nothing about Maggies,--but I can ID those horns as commercial units that Seeburg used in every Jukebox they built from 1968 untill they went out of biz. The company that built them was called "Heppner" --not quite sure of the spelling--and the speakers, other then the sq. magnets appear to be the same as were used by Seeburg also--- Ron Rich

Thanks for the info, Ron....

Just curious as to what this guy has. I'm not sure of what I actually have, just opened up a 1966 brochure and boom, there they were, so I'm assuming I have a pair of Francisco's. One is in the living room and the "new/older" one I picked up several weeks ago is out in the garage for now.

They listed for $650 and the one in the garage has the optional $249 reel-to-reel deck. I think I paid about $17.50 for that one, but no room to haul it into the house right now. Someday, I'll get around to taking off the backs and see what's in these things.

There are subtle cabinet differences (dark panels on front), the receivers have different knobs, and they have different turntables, which brings up another point.

Since these two units have different cartridges, then the tuner/preamp would have to be tweaked to accommodate the different output of those cartridges, probably an R207-01-00 or one of the mary variants of that. --BB

Bobby Basham
Tucson, Arizona

Bobby, I'm pretty sure the cart was the same in both the black plastic arm and the post '67 metal one. I have a 1965 w/black arm and in summer 1990 found and parted at later one, I still have the TT and the cart similar but with that goofy one-screw mounting.

I replaced the original cart with a Pickering magnetic and added a preamp. I got rid the last of the tracking distortion but added too much deep bass so that feedback occurred. I added at choke across the pre's output channels to mono the lows and that stopped the feedback.

I've never seem a magnavox with closed back speaker boxes. How does it sound compared to the usual ones with a common area for everything. The only question I'd have about that better arrangement is the use of a big, stiff cone speaker in a relatively small box -that usually is the makings of "headache bass".

Two months ago a neighbor in a townhouse tossed a 1967 Fisher "Custom Electra" console. It was pretty dirty and musty. It looked like it had been in some deep basement for a few decades. I did keep the receiver and Dual turntable w/Pickering mag cart. Both have been washed and do work. Later found a Fisher enclosure that fits the receiver and the TT will need a standard Dual base.

Rob/NYC

Hey Rob,

The cartridges cannot be the same because of the fit. The newer turntable would take an EV275 cartridge that puts out about .33 volts, while the older black tonearm would have a larger cartridge putting out about 1.0 volts. I have three other Astro-Sonics with the black tonearm, and those cartridges are no way similar to those small EV275/Astatic 165D cartridges found in the newer W620 series turntables.

I have tried swapping one of those small cartridges into a black tonearm Maggie, and the volume output was way low. Can't even remember how I mounted the thing, but it had a nice sound, and made you wanna attach a preamp to boost the signal.

As far as my two units go, they are not in service. The living room unit with the dark panels will play for about one second and the sound dies. Haven't touched it in over five years (procrastination). My cousin gave it to me before he went back to Pennsylvania to help his mom and ailing father. His father died, and then he died about aweek later. Mom had to deal with two funerals.

Anyhoo, the garage unit (radio) plays pretty loud, but has a frozen treble switch, scratchy controls, missing a needle and a spliced power cord. Didn't test the reel-to reel. I plugged it in for about 30 seconds to see what it could do, and it's been sitting ever since until I take time to get out there and check it out.

I don't know what the sound would be like, but I do have a 70's unit with big, bullet-shaped styrofoam enclosures with small woofers that really kicks butt. It's not like the boominess of a big hollow cabinet, maybe more tighter bass.

If you're lucky to find one of those higher end Imperials or something from the "Spirit of 76" collection, you'll surely be amused at the sound. Look at some of the models posted on Magnavoxfriends.com. They also have schematics posted there. --BB

Bobby Basham
Tucson, Arizona

Not to nitpick, but the cartridges in those Maggies have outputs from 160 mv up to 550mv - there is no ceramic that can output 1 volt, except for the Astatic "power point" plug-in mono cartridges - and they certainly aren't used in these consoles.

Matt, the Super-Crap BSR carts on some of their Mini Changers in the late-60's and early 70's did have 1 volt/channel.

They were AWFUL. Stiff plastic cantilever coupled to a plastic arm with high resonance point -the arms would hop right across the record when it hit a strong bass note. Not to mention the gross distortion and wear.

Several of my young teen contemporaries had these players and there were several records that they simply couldn't play. I did change one of their carts to an ElectroVoice of some sort with a metal cantilever. The output was lower, but it sounded and tracked well.

I don't know how all those companies got away with selling junk like this.

Rob/NYC

To get the highest output from a crystal or ceramic element, the stylus itself has to be closely coupled to the element - thus attaining maximum "velocity/transference", but also lowering compliance at the same time.
Yes, those types of cartridges are crap in my opinion.
They all need a heavy tracking force to negotiate grooves - wearing the grooves.
I call them record-eaters.
The high-output of the Astatic plug-in cartridges is because the actual stylus is glued directly to the element.

On the other side of the rock, the Zenith 2G style cartridges are low-output types, but with maximum compliance. - and low record wear.

Magnavox used some decent cartidges - the EV brand, assorted models, I can say are easy on records.

If at all possible, upgrading is the key - nothing beats a good Magnetic.

Hey everyone! I am the mystery man that Bobby talked about emailing. I will make a full update on my newly acquired Astro Sonic soon, but in the mean time, here is a picture gallery of my progress so far:

https://picasaweb.google.com/1167507662 ... directlink

Also, the thing DOES sound amazing. I can't wait to recap it and seal it all up nice and tight. I'll post more later. Feel free to ask any questions about the pictures I have posted and I'll answer them the best I can.

As far as output goes, I was just going by an old phono cartridge chart from Garage-a-Records. That's where those numbers came from.

Anyhoo, I found a posting from somebody at Magnavoxfriends, that I printed several months ago and it was laying on my consoles.

Quote:

"The fool-proof way to find out if any Magnavox console with side-mounted woofers is a top-of-the-line Imperial is to take off the back...If you can see ANY speakers...it is NOT an Imperial. Imperials all had sealed speaker compartments. If the method of achieving sealed speakers is ALL WOOD...it's an Imperial. If the sealed enclosures are made of styrofoam...it's NOT an Imperial.

There was an Astro-Sonic 100 model with four horns that are not sealed...and it is not an Imperial. The first and second series top-of-the-line Imperials had the patented acoustical tunnel (as did Concert Grand models from 1959-1962). The final Imperial series had sealed enclosures but no tunnel."

The early 1964 - 1967 Mediterranean and Early American consoles shared outer cabinets with the Astro-Sonic 100 counterpart models. There is no external way to tell them apart. Open the lid on these two designs, and if it has Power Tuning...it's an Imperial. But even if it doesn't have Power Tuning, it might be an Imperial because you could buy them without the Remote!

Take it for what it's worth. I've never delved that deeply into all many models out there, being smitten with the several Astro-Sonics that I have, but wouldn't mind having an Imperial or two up in the camp, to compare side-by-side with the As100 counterparts. I like my other consoles, too. Magnavox wasn't the only game in town back in the day, and I appreciate them also. "Variety is the spice of life." --BB

Bobby Basham
Tucson, Arizona

Well, I finally got around to taking the backs off these two beasts. The living-room Maggie is definitely an August/1966 Francisco. Someone had ingeniously hooked up a stereo headphone jack to the external speaker terminals. I thought about doing that years ago with one of my consoles, but why bother when they sound so glorious without it. This is the one with the dark front panels and a W620 series changer.

My second console is older and looks similar but with light front panels, but what a different creature. The model number has been rubbed off, but it has sealed wooden chambers, four horns and a tunnel connecting the two chambers and a reel tape deck. It dates from April, 1965 and has the older W604 series changer with the black, curved tonearm.

Is this second unit possibly some type of Imperial? I'm totally clueless when it comes to Imperials, Concert Grands and all the other fancy names out there. I know there are some with remotes with some special designation on the tuner faceplate, but some of you Maggie fanatics out there can answer my question and set the record straight. --BB

Bobby Basham
Tucson, Arizona

Duh, I guess my previous post answered my question. Four horns, sealed chambers and accoustical tunnel. Sorry for wasting so much bandwith. --BB

Bobby Basham
Tucson, Arizona