Rockola 442 Coin / Credit Question

Psychman · by **Psychman** » Mon Sep 01, 2014 8:08 pm

I finally got a coin slot windows and select light etc for my 442. So I thought I'd have a play with some coins.

One observation, my machine takes 5p and 10p coins. When the 5p falls it hits the 10c coin switch, 1 credit is added. When a 10p falls it hits the 50c coin switch and adds only 2 credits. This seems a little odd to me as I'd expect 3 credits.

I'm going through the manual trying to work this out. Both other (not used) switches add only 1 credit also.

Should I be looking at the credit unit? The manual mentions adjusting the ratches to change credit actions, but I cant seem to work out what to adjust.

I recently replaced my credit coils, and something I did notice is that all 3 coils were connected together, on the left terminal. This is if you unscrew the credit unit and pull it forwards and look down at it. When I replaced the coils naturally I replaced this, but I wonder if this is some strange "gepetto" mod?

clones · by **clones** » Tue Sep 02, 2014 2:04 am

Hi
There's usually a master ratchet and two other ratchets which are adjustable, you will need a small screwdriver or similar tool to adjust, the number of teeth usually correlate with the number of credits
regards
clones

by **Ron Rich** » Tue Sep 02, 2014 2:26 am

I think I can explain this US dollar terms, and I think it will "translate" for you---
When that phonograph was introduced, the pricing thorough the US varied from region to region. It was also offered with an optional "half dollar" acceptor (Nickel, Dime, Quarter, Half-dollar "NDQH"), or just a three coin acceptor (NDQ). Further, the earlier models all were offered priced at a nickel per play. When the nickel per play was changing to a dime per play, the juke makers offered a coin acceptor (slug rejector), to which they had add a nickel flipper. The nickel flipper could be set so that EVERY nickel hit the switch, OR, so only every other nickel hit the switch. The problem was that there were only three coin coils--so if in a phono that had the optional Half-doll equipment, the nickel switch activated the dime coil (every OTHER, NICKEL, hit the switch), and the nickel COIL was used as a Half-dollar coil. You may have, or may not have the correct coin equipment for the way the pricing unit is set--
As for the three coils connected to the same place--normal--that's the common side--Ron Rich

Psychman · by **Psychman** » Tue Sep 02, 2014 1:36 pm

Ron, that's very interesting, I did not know that.

Mine has a box under the credit unit, which looks like the box referred to in the sales brochures as

"2 plays - 2 bits" - "Built in conversion kit allows instantaneous conversion from "2 plays - 2 bits" to standard pricing"

The box has a switch on the side, so I'm wondering now what impact this switch will have on the operation. I'll try flipping it and then retest the credit operations.

Psychman · by **Psychman** » Tue Sep 02, 2014 4:51 pm

Clones, any pointer on adjusting the ratchets? It doesn't really jump out at me so any pointers will assist my fiddling this evening

clones · by **clones** » Tue Sep 02, 2014 5:27 pm

Hi
this description might not sound too technical but here goes
you would be better to remove the credit unit section first, on two of the ratchets you should see a slider type piece called the wafer with an eye at one end, if you put a small screwdriver end into the eye and and lift slightly and either pull or push into the various holes/indents, keep the ratchet from moving while you are doing this
regards
clones

by **Ron Rich** » Tue Sep 02, 2014 6:35 pm

"Adjusting" the ratchets" should be covered in the manual ??--
That kit, I assume, is something like the one Seeburg used to allow "Half-dollar" use---not familiar at all, with it, but it probably 'converts" one coin switch from one coil to another, and contains a relay to add a 2nd (maybe plus 1 more ?) pulse when a half-dollar was dropped in the coin chute??

Psychman · by **Psychman** » Wed Sep 03, 2014 1:06 pm

I flipped the switch and observed no difference to the credit added by each switch. BUT, I did hear a metallic clunk sound whenever the 10c (5p in my machine) switch was actuated. Perhaps that sound is a relay firing but perhaps it's contacts are dirty, I've never opened the box before to look. As you say id expect this on the 50c switch also, so maybe someone also moved the connections around. I'll have a play around tonight

The service manual mentions ratchet adjustment, but gives no guidance on how it's done exactly. I guess they assumed some knowledge i don't have . From what clones has said I think I can work it out.

It's not a big deal but id like to be able to run the machine on coins and not have to enter them quite as often as I do, so far my collection of these coins is very small so I end up reaching inside to retrieve them a lot!

DoghouseRiley · by **DoghouseRiley** » Wed Sep 03, 2014 3:48 pm

Psychman wrote:I flipped the switch and observed no difference to the credit added by each switch. BUT, I did hear a metallic clunk sound whenever the 10c (5p in my machine) switch was actuated. Perhaps that sound is a relay firing but perhaps it's contacts are dirty, I've never opened the box before to look. As you say id expect this on the 50c switch also, so maybe someone also moved the connections around. I'll have a play around tonight

The service manual mentions ratchet adjustment, but gives no guidance on how it's done exactly. I guess they assumed some knowledge i don't have . From what clones has said I think I can work it out.

It's not a big deal but id like to be able to run the machine on coins and not have to enter them quite as often as I do, so far my collection of these coins is very small so I end up reaching inside to retrieve them a lot!

My 468 can either be operated by adding credits or putting 10ps in it. I've a lot of those. I actually seem to get a bit of satisfaction "collecting the cash" after about 50 plays. The 443 is on "freeplay."

With my two wall boxes, one's on freeplay, the other takes either 10ps or seven plays for 50p. I quite like emptying that cash box too!
The fact that it's only my money I'm taking out, doesn't seem to matter.

Psychman · by **Psychman** » Wed Sep 03, 2014 4:57 pm

I can see the appeal, would be a good way to save up money too!

Sadly my 442 takes old 10ps, 5ps and the pre-decimal equivalents, sadly not legal tender for some time. I could get another mech, but it seems less authentic then!

DoghouseRiley · by **DoghouseRiley** » Wed Sep 03, 2014 8:08 pm

Psychman wrote:I can see the appeal, would be a good way to save up money too!

Sadly my 442 takes old 10ps, 5ps and the pre-decimal equivalents, sadly not legal tender for some time. I could get another mech, but it seems less authentic then!

Mine only take "old money," but it doesn't lessen the appeal though.

I do get a sense of satisfaction when visitors see them for the first time. The response to "Can I have a go?" is always, "Of course you can, put your money in." I often have to stop them attempting to do so.

Psychman · by **Psychman** » Wed Sep 03, 2014 10:33 pm

Took a look at the ratchets on the credit accumaltor, I dismantled the accumaltor a little and after playing with it a bit I worked it out. I now have the "correct" pricing being applied (5p - 2 plays / 10p - 5 plays)

DoghouseRiley · by **DoghouseRiley** » Wed Sep 03, 2014 11:11 pm

Psychman wrote:Took a look at the ratchets on the credit accumaltor, I dismantled the accumaltor a little and after playing with it a bit I worked it out. I now have the "correct" pricing being applied (5p - 2 plays / 10p - 5 plays)

I think you've made it too cheap. You're never gonna make any money at that rate.

Those prices are for when petrol was 2/- a gallon and best bitter 1/9d

Digressing.... I can remember the late fifties when it was 1 play for 3d and three plays for 6d. in a Soho coffee bar, near where I and my future wife lived. The following week we were a bit miffed to find they'd changed it to 6d and 1/-.
So I tried a 3d bit and after a couple of goes it finally took it and gave me five plays. I guess the adjustments made to the coin mech wasn't quite right.

Psychman · by **Psychman** » Thu Sep 04, 2014 10:03 am

haha, yeah its not a lucrative operation!

Im sadly too young to remember 1970, I werent even around till some time after that! Would 1970 prices have been 5p for 1 play and 10p for 3 plays?

DoghouseRiley · by **DoghouseRiley** » Thu Sep 04, 2014 10:39 am

Psychman wrote:haha, yeah its not a lucrative operation!

Im sadly too young to remember 1970, I weren't even around till some time after that! Would 1970 prices have been 5p for 1 play and 10p for 3 plays?

It's hard to remember, but it could have been. Same with a lot of stuff prices varied according to location. Decimal coinage came in in 1971. A local hotel had a 468 in their lounge bar, in the mid-seventies, I can remember gong there on Friday nights for a few pints with a neighbour and putting coins in it occasionally, for one play, but whether five or ten pence I can't remember.

1958/9, sticks in my mind as I was still a teenager. I was earning £8 a week, not yet moved out of my parent's house and considered myself reasonably well off. It's interesting to know that the price of a pint of beer remained pretty much half the cost of a gallon of petrol for several decades after that. Tell that wasn't "manipulation" by the government. In 1959 my future wife and I moved in together in a flat in Soho above a milk bar (already they were going out of style). Some of the happiest times of our lives. We were in Ronnie Scott's club most week-day evenings, as it was free except for the week-ends and warmer than our flat. Many of local coffee bars had the new American jukeboxes, as the import restrictions had been lifted. Previously, we'd only seen the "fish tank" Bal-Amis, as about 60% of such things had to be made in Britain.
Though before I left home, we used to go to the Eel Pie Island Hotel at Twickenham on Saturday nights, where all the popular jazz band appeared in rotation. I can remember they had an old Wurly 1015 in one of the bars that played 68s. I guess they got that from an American air base when it closed down after the war.

Prices of everything have escalated by so much since then. We bought our three-bed detached in 1972, with a fair-sized garden, in a still sought-after location, I think I was earning about £3,500 a year at the time. The house cost about a third of the price it would cost me to buy again the car I'm presently driving.

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