Tormat / scanning problem

I have an lp 480 see burg. When I press the buttons to select a record, it scans twice and then stops. I've cleaned every contact in the machine. The two bulbs a t the bottom of the tormat light up purple but while the machine is in scan I can press the relay and it will pick up and play the record perfectly. The trip selector works. The machine was playing perfectly up until now. Any ideas on how to fix?

Purchase a Service manual package ( see "announcements" section above-"where to find"), Read it, and the trouble shooting guide, and you should be able to pinpoint, down to a component, where your problem roosts. Do NOT "muck around" in what you are mistakenly calling the "Tormat", as there is voltage high enough in it, to kill you ! Best bet is to call a pro--- Ron Rich

The advice to get a manual is best especially with these old tube units and the control unit should be rebuilt if it has not been...In the interim, try swapping the 2050 trip tubes and then the 12AX7 pulse amp tubes. Better if you have known-good spares.

Beyond that you will need service info and a degree of knowledge of electronic circuits. The LPC is Seeburg's most complex and potentially difficult machines to repair.....Naturally, I'm probably the last idiot in the Western Hemisphere to have one on location..

Rob/NYC

Rob,
I am sorta the other "idiot", in that I maintain a location owned HLPC, connected to about 20 -3W1's--
No problem for me--I love that design-- Ron Rich

I have an lp 480 see burg. When I press the buttons to select a record, it scans twice and then stops. I've cleaned every contact in the machine. The two bulbs a t the bottom of the tormat light up purple but while the machine is in scan I can press the relay and it will pick up and play the record perfectly. The trip selector works. The machine was playing perfectly up until now. Any ideas on how to fix?

FOLLOW UP... I have replaced all the bulbs in the tormat. I have cleaned every contact. I bought another tormat for parts, which I have put in the machine but it does the same exact thing as previously stated. I bought a troubleshooting book and when I do the jumper test, the mech trips and plays a record. After it plays, I try to do the battery test but nothing happens. I don't have the Seeburg neon test light to do the next test. Can anyone give me any ideas on what else I can check. Anyone with a similar problem, please share how you fixed it.

First of all, please use the terms in the manuals--I assume you mean "tubes" when you use the word "bulbs" ?
What are you calling a "Tormat" ?
The test light can be built using a number 51H neon, and a 330k ohm resistor in series.
Ron Rich

Sorry...I'm a bit newbee to jukeboxes but I am completely mechanical literate as I am a mechanic by occupation. Meant tubes when I said bulbs. The manual calls this Tormat I refer to as Tormat Control center. In fact, purchased it on ebay here, which called it "Seeburg Tormat Control Center Type TCC1". Just lookin for some help... is there a place where I can purchase this Seeburg neon test lamp? I'm not familiar with the parts you mention.

Eddie, the original neon test light that Seeburg sold was supposedly selected to have a critical ignition point such that it would indicate certain voltages in the readout and write-in circuits.

If you want a similar test lamp you can get one at nearly any hardware store. Here's a pic:http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Neon_Test_Lamp.jpg

Frankly, they are a waste of time as are most of the procedures that advise their use. These procedures were meant as field troubleshooting guides to steer the 'tech' to which unit had to be replaced (control center-pulse amp, etc) They would then be taken to a Seeburg dealer and exchanged or repaired there. Those options are of course long gone.

Since your unit scans but only trips when you push down one of the two relays in the control unit, I have some basic questions:

1) Do the two 0A2 tubes flicker slightly --only-- when the mech goes from left to right? On this model, they must not flicker when going in the other direction (R-to-L).

2) Have you checked the wires on the contact plunger block. That is the device that rides under the Tormat memory unit (that is the Tormat BTW) at the rear under the record rack.

3) -Were the pulse amps rebuilt/ you should replace the .047 cap and at least test the 5.6 megohm resistor. Both are directly attached to the 12AX7 tube base.

Do you have a means of testing voltage? A DVM is best but a VTVM will be fine too. the point is to avoid cheap analog meters that will load these high impedance circuits and give false readings.

Does the schematic you are working with have voltages and tube pin numbers? THAT is how you deal with this sort of problem.

Rob/NYC

Ok Eddie, I'm responding to your P-M here because I've ul'd two files that may also help others:

http://s1192.photobucket.com/albums/aa3 ... iscosw.jpg

http://s1192.photobucket.com/albums/aa3 ... iscosw.jpg

These are the LPC read-out circuits with, and without the "discotheque" at the rear of the machine.

The absence of flickering in the 0A2 tube during L-R scanning points to two resistors: The 56K-ohm coming from a pin on one 0A2 and the 36-ohm which couples the voltage to the mech. Both of these are common trouble areas in -all- of the old 50's and 60's Tormat Seeburgs.

For the 56K I use four 220K's in parallel and the 36 can be made from any convenient combination. This circuit has a wide rage of tolerance for these resistor in the upwards failure mode, I've had a 56K read over 200K and still work but after a certain point they typically lose too much carbon internally that they open altogether.

As a general point, carbon resistors in pulsed circuits have a higher failure rate than steady-state circuits.

Note also that there are contacts on the mech reversing sw that short out (through a 4.7K-ohm) the read out voltage when the mech travels R-L.

Give these suggestions a try and we'll see from there.

BTW: the 0A2's glow should be contained inside the 'can' and not be too bright -but that is subjective.

Rob/NYC