Hi all,
Below is a re-posted, with written permission, item --
My questions are--what "value" coin(s) are "counter-fitted", (as far as I know, that does not happen here), and, how can a 12 sided coin be used in any automatic machine ( coins seem to have a problem rolling downhill, even when round?) ?? Ron Rich
UK to go 12 Sided
STAR TECH Journal's Online Tech Forum
Today at 7:15 AM
To
ronnnrich@yahoo.com
------------------------------------------------------------
STAR TECH Journal Message Board: Coin-Op News: UK to go 12 Sided
------------------------------------------------------------
Posted by STAR TECH Journal on Friday, March 21, 2014 - 10:11 am:
The UK is to get a new 12-sided � coin to replace the current coin
which has been in circulation for over 30 years.
It will not be the first that the country has had: there was a
12-sided threepenny coin in the pre-decimal years, going out of
circulation in 1971.
Two different coloured metals will be used in the coin, which will
enter circulation in 2017. According to the companies which
traditionally handle coins in change machines and money processors,
the new shape will not offer any particular problems.
It will be, says the Royal Mint, �he most secure coin in the world,�a coin to beat the counterfeiters, which will be good as currently the
UK has about 45 million fakes in circulation.
UK--12 sided coin(s) ?
The lounge where a collector can relax. For topics that don't fit into the forums.
Hi Ron,
The bean counters have come up with another great idea (a bit like your half and dollar coins to commemorate baseball, a curved coin, I ask you).
With regards to the UK coin a £1 is worth nothing and yes they recon that there is around 30 million forgeries in circulation. What the pinheads do not realise that it would be far cheaper to continue with what we already have, it bought and paid for including all the tooling.
A number of our new coins such as the 10p are metalic and course in case case of the old coin mechanisms such as jukeboxes catch on magnets and the reject will not budge them.
Every time we change coins in this country it costs operators and companies big time for conversion charges especially with electronic coin mechanisms.
Moan over.
Regards
Alan
Alan Hood
ami-man
The bean counters have come up with another great idea (a bit like your half and dollar coins to commemorate baseball, a curved coin, I ask you).
With regards to the UK coin a £1 is worth nothing and yes they recon that there is around 30 million forgeries in circulation. What the pinheads do not realise that it would be far cheaper to continue with what we already have, it bought and paid for including all the tooling.
A number of our new coins such as the 10p are metalic and course in case case of the old coin mechanisms such as jukeboxes catch on magnets and the reject will not budge them.
Every time we change coins in this country it costs operators and companies big time for conversion charges especially with electronic coin mechanisms.
Moan over.
Regards
Alan
Alan Hood
ami-man
-
Ron Rich
Topic author - Forum Moderator
- Posts: 8193
- Joined: Sun May 06, 2007 11:31 pm
- Location: Millbrae (San Francisco area)CA, USA
Hi Alan,
Thanks--the concept of a "counterfeit coin", is "alien" to me, having never knowingly seen one.
Just seems to me to be an awful lot of effort, for little or no gain !
Here, in the past, when our coins had "some" value, I have seen "kids" sit for long periods of time "filing down" pennies, to the smaller size of dimes, to use in a coin-op. machine. (usually to obtain a candy bar--sometimes to play a jukebox). I have seen "plenty" of counterfeit "paper money", in all denominations.
Ron Rich
Thanks--the concept of a "counterfeit coin", is "alien" to me, having never knowingly seen one.
Just seems to me to be an awful lot of effort, for little or no gain !
Here, in the past, when our coins had "some" value, I have seen "kids" sit for long periods of time "filing down" pennies, to the smaller size of dimes, to use in a coin-op. machine. (usually to obtain a candy bar--sometimes to play a jukebox). I have seen "plenty" of counterfeit "paper money", in all denominations.
Ron Rich
Hi Ron,
When we were operating we came across loads of fake blank coins or strimming coin mechs or coins atached with fishing line. We have seen coins with tape round them and then covered with silver paper (tin foil) the most effort used was a load of bronze cut bar that was used the same size as the old style large 50P coin. That must have cost the company they worked for a fortune.
The next thing over here is going to be plastic notes, which seem rife for problem to me.
Regards
Alan
When we were operating we came across loads of fake blank coins or strimming coin mechs or coins atached with fishing line. We have seen coins with tape round them and then covered with silver paper (tin foil) the most effort used was a load of bronze cut bar that was used the same size as the old style large 50P coin. That must have cost the company they worked for a fortune.
The next thing over here is going to be plastic notes, which seem rife for problem to me.
Regards
Alan
-
Ron Rich
Topic author - Forum Moderator
- Posts: 8193
- Joined: Sun May 06, 2007 11:31 pm
- Location: Millbrae (San Francisco area)CA, USA
Hi Alan,
You have "jogged" my memory--
I have seen "blanks" used in the slide type coin mechs--had a "large case" of this in a bar pool table. This bar was located near the union, electricians hall, and the blanks, were the "knock-out plugs" used in electrical junction boxes--.
We cured this by adding large magnets to the top of the slides, which would "pull up" on a blank, thus stopping it from being accepted.
Also, this reminded e of something my Grandfather told me--
He said that he lived in a home somewhere, that the gas supplier had installed "curb-side" coin slots. This required dropping a Nickel into the slot to obtain gas. In order to "cheat" the gas company, 'people" ( "NOT, my family, of course !"), would freeze water in the shape of a Nickel. This was only possible to do for about two weeks after the collector's monthly collection, because if done any longer, the cash-box would fill up with water, the collector would then wise up, and turn off the supply.
On the"plastic paper money"--I think you will do just fine with it. I have seen some "samples" of other countries money that are "plastic". As far as I can determine, it has no downside--just up-sides. I wish we would do that instead of the "crap" done to prevent counterfeits here.
Ron Rich
You have "jogged" my memory--
I have seen "blanks" used in the slide type coin mechs--had a "large case" of this in a bar pool table. This bar was located near the union, electricians hall, and the blanks, were the "knock-out plugs" used in electrical junction boxes--.
We cured this by adding large magnets to the top of the slides, which would "pull up" on a blank, thus stopping it from being accepted.
Also, this reminded e of something my Grandfather told me--
He said that he lived in a home somewhere, that the gas supplier had installed "curb-side" coin slots. This required dropping a Nickel into the slot to obtain gas. In order to "cheat" the gas company, 'people" ( "NOT, my family, of course !"), would freeze water in the shape of a Nickel. This was only possible to do for about two weeks after the collector's monthly collection, because if done any longer, the cash-box would fill up with water, the collector would then wise up, and turn off the supply.
On the"plastic paper money"--I think you will do just fine with it. I have seen some "samples" of other countries money that are "plastic". As far as I can determine, it has no downside--just up-sides. I wish we would do that instead of the "crap" done to prevent counterfeits here.
Ron Rich
-
DoghouseRiley
- Senior Member
- Posts: 630
- Joined: Thu Apr 16, 2009 9:48 pm
- Location: North-West England
I'm going back to the late fifties early sixties now.
My future wife and I had a flat in Soho and we frequented the coffee bars and jazz clubs quite a bit.
As far as I can remember, the original pricing for most jukeboxes were a "Thruppeny bit" (as we called them, for one play and sixpence for three or whatever, so they were configured for twelve sided coins.
I remember this, as in one coffee bar there was a new jukebox, an American import, previously most bars had Bal-Ami juniors etc., until the relaxation of the law that said such equipment had to be of over 60% British manufacture.
Anyway, the coins this one would take were only sixpences and shillings. I put my thruppeny bit in and still got five plays!
My future wife and I had a flat in Soho and we frequented the coffee bars and jazz clubs quite a bit.
As far as I can remember, the original pricing for most jukeboxes were a "Thruppeny bit" (as we called them, for one play and sixpence for three or whatever, so they were configured for twelve sided coins.
I remember this, as in one coffee bar there was a new jukebox, an American import, previously most bars had Bal-Ami juniors etc., until the relaxation of the law that said such equipment had to be of over 60% British manufacture.
Anyway, the coins this one would take were only sixpences and shillings. I put my thruppeny bit in and still got five plays!
______________________________________________________________________________________________________
I don't mind if you don't like my manners, I don't like them myself, they're pretty bad, I grieve over them on long winter evenings.
-
Record-changer
- Senior Member
- Posts: 1139
- Joined: Fri Apr 21, 2006 8:11 pm
- Location: Bloomington IN USA
I repaired coin testers for several years. I have some items to add to this:
The 12, 20, etc, facets on a coin and the milling on the coin (the tiny axial grooves around most US coins) have a different purpose: to keep dishonest people from stealing metal from the rims of the coins.
In the 1800s, criminals would file metal from the rims of $20 gold pieces and spend the filings as gold dust. The coins became smaller and smaller as more criminals repeated the theft from the same coin. The US Mint put milling around the edges of coins to prevent this.
I know of several attempts to cheat vending machines:
1. In one case, punched copper discs were passing the coin testers as quarters. The diameter and thickness were so close that adjusting the mechanism for size was useless. However, the speed was different, so adjusting the separator after the anvil worked. But we then found out the copper was worth more than a quarter. Someone was stealing them from a waste copper recovery bin at a factory. We reported it to the factory and the thefts ended.
2. We got a few cases where a penny jammed in a spark plug washer got past the testers. But again, the washer was worth more than a quarter, so someone was stealing them. We reported it to the company the washers were coming from and the thefts ended.
3. We ordered and installed the optional thread cutters after people were dropping coins with tiny holes drilled in the rim with thread attached. To play again, they pulled the coin up past the coin switch and let it drop again.
4. Parking validation tokens issued by the city were found in cash boxes. But testing showed that they fell in via a path that did not trip the coin switch. So we got free tokens for nothing.
5. Magnets are provided to change the coin's rolling speed. A steel coin never get's past the magnet.
6. I once found a Mexican peso in the cash box. It was too big to have gotten in there via the normal route. I asked the boss about it. He said he put it in there to see if anyone was stealing from the coin boxes. If it was gone the next time he collected and it didn't show up in the collection, then an employee was helping himself to the proceeds.
6. The shaved coins mentioned above don't get past the size testers. So a genuine coin that has had metal removed from it is not accepted.
The 12, 20, etc, facets on a coin and the milling on the coin (the tiny axial grooves around most US coins) have a different purpose: to keep dishonest people from stealing metal from the rims of the coins.
In the 1800s, criminals would file metal from the rims of $20 gold pieces and spend the filings as gold dust. The coins became smaller and smaller as more criminals repeated the theft from the same coin. The US Mint put milling around the edges of coins to prevent this.
I know of several attempts to cheat vending machines:
1. In one case, punched copper discs were passing the coin testers as quarters. The diameter and thickness were so close that adjusting the mechanism for size was useless. However, the speed was different, so adjusting the separator after the anvil worked. But we then found out the copper was worth more than a quarter. Someone was stealing them from a waste copper recovery bin at a factory. We reported it to the factory and the thefts ended.
2. We got a few cases where a penny jammed in a spark plug washer got past the testers. But again, the washer was worth more than a quarter, so someone was stealing them. We reported it to the company the washers were coming from and the thefts ended.
3. We ordered and installed the optional thread cutters after people were dropping coins with tiny holes drilled in the rim with thread attached. To play again, they pulled the coin up past the coin switch and let it drop again.
4. Parking validation tokens issued by the city were found in cash boxes. But testing showed that they fell in via a path that did not trip the coin switch. So we got free tokens for nothing.
5. Magnets are provided to change the coin's rolling speed. A steel coin never get's past the magnet.
6. I once found a Mexican peso in the cash box. It was too big to have gotten in there via the normal route. I asked the boss about it. He said he put it in there to see if anyone was stealing from the coin boxes. If it was gone the next time he collected and it didn't show up in the collection, then an employee was helping himself to the proceeds.
6. The shaved coins mentioned above don't get past the size testers. So a genuine coin that has had metal removed from it is not accepted.
Who is online
Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest
It is currently Thu Oct 06, 2016 8:48 am