Seeburg LPC1 plays slow

Hello everyone,

My name is Mark and I am new to this forum. I recently restored a Seeburg LPC1 and am having a problem that I cannot figure out. The jukebox has been completely gone over. Mech cleaned and lubed, all electronics re capped and gone over, yet I am having a slow play problem. When I go to play a 45, the mech scans fine, but runs slow when the 45 goes to play. If I "warm" it up by running the mech in an empty spot for a few minutes it eventually comes up to speed. I have checked all the switches, relays, contacts, caps, the motor and both motor caps but nothing seems to help. What am I missing in the auto speed unit that would cause this ? I have read that this is a frequent problem with these units, but I though I would be able to rectify it somehow. Any help would be appreciated !

Thanks,
Mark

Hi Mark,
Welcome !
I cover this extensively in my "Seeburg Mechanism Guide"--but what it boils down to is lubrication, mostly of the motor, but all bearings and adjustments for thrust are also somewhat involved.
Most likely, at sometime someone has used the "wrong" lubricants, and this has "gummed up" the motor++--
Also, the motor rubber parts can be missing, or "hard", incorrectly installed, or needing replacement.
(PM me if you wish to purchase a copy of the guide)
Ron Rich

Hi Ron,

Thank you for the reply. I purchased your guide a while ago, and it has been very helpful to me. I have thoroughly cleaned this mech and have re lubricated it. I have taken apart the motor, un gummed it and re lubricated it as well. Any worn part or hard rubber part has been replaced. Everything seems very "free" I might be wrong, but i am thinking this is an electrical problem in the speed control ? But I am not sure where ?

Thanks,
Mark

Mere cleaning of the visible surface of the motor bearings is not enough to "un-gum" them of decades of old oil.
The application of fresh oil is only a temporary solution.
The old lubricant is deep within the sintered bronze bearing itself.
This tends to cause a sluggish motor when cold, acting like a viscose fluid until warm.
A deep extended soak in solvent is required, and I follow it with the tip of a soldering iron inserted into the bearing - the heat forces out the old oil - the bearing actually bubbles the old oil out.
Then a flush with more solvent, and re-lube with Zoom tubine oil, nothing less.

OK, I will try cleaning the motor again and the mech and re lubricating. On another thought, is there a way for me to eliminate the auto speed unit ? I am never going to play 33 1/3 records. Would older gears fit this mech to convert it back to just play 45's at 60hz ?

Thanks,
Mark

Hi Mark,
The Autospeed is reliable, but you can, if you wish change the gears. However this will not cause the motor to run at the correct speed when cold--it will still run slow, but you may not notice it as much. Use an older, or newer, set--Changing them is a PIA, as far as I'm concerned--Ron Rich

Hi Ron,

Just trying to decide which is the best way for me to proceed to make this unit reliable for me. I have already rebuilt the auto speed unit, thoroughly cleaned and lubricated the motor and mech, and even after all that it plays 45's slow. My one 33 1/3 record plays fine all the time. From what I have read on the internet, this was a common problem. It almost seems like the auto speed unit is not capable of supplying the motor with the power it would need to overcome any resistance. Would you say that is true from your experience ? I have worked on older Seeburgs that only played 45's that have played slow because they were "gummed up" , but not slow too the degree that this unit plays....yet at the same time, it plays the 33 1/3 fine ? Just want the best, most permanent solution.

Thanks again,
Mark

Mark,
IMHO--that's a "Chicken/egg question" ( which came first??) The "best" solution, once again, IMHO, is to get a Bodine KCI 42 A-1 motor--- Ron Rich

Stupid question but if 33 1/3 plays fine all the time as opposed to 45's could that indicate a problem other than lubrication? Same motor.

If, once the proper flushing and re-lubrication is done, and the motor still runs slow at first on 45's, I'd suspect weak capacitors in the autospeed chassis.

Matt, & all,
This is a motor or thrust bearing/lubrication problem, or incorrectly installed coupler ! If an Autospeed problem"--ie "weak caps", the motor will operate fine when cold--but slow down as it warms up ! If a Bodine brand motor, it normally runs at 140 F (60 C), above room temp. Ron Rich

I'm no technician, but this conversation has captured my interest. I own an LPC-480 that plays both the 33-1/3 "Little LP's" and 45s without problems. When you say your 45s are being played really slow, I'm wondering "how slow?" Are they perhaps being played at 33-1/3? And if so, since 33-1/3 is native on these boxes, is it possible that the little button that is supposed to be depressed whenever the mech picks up a 45 isn't for some reason being depressed? Is it possible that that button (or switch or whatever it is -- remember, I told you I'm no technician!) is stuck and isn't being pushed down to change the speed to 45 RPM?

There, now that I've made a complete fool of myself, I'll exit this thread but will continue to follow it. I enjoy coming to this board and reading about the various jukeboxes.

Good luck with your LPC1

Hi Bob,B.
I have no objection to you, or anyone else reading this--but PLEASE, READ it, before writing--
Mark wrote "--Slow when COLD---" This is about 99% sure it is a motor lubrication problem. 1 % it's another lubrication problem. Hint--on your LPC, I suggest that you at least, fill the oil cups on the motor with the proper oil--two or three times---before you have the same problem ! Ron Rich

Thanks Ron. I have a tech coming out to fix the reversing relay problem I brought up in another thread. A proper cleaning and lubrication is on the TO DO list!

Hello everyone,

Just want to post an update for everyone who may be following this. I went and cleaned and re lubricated the motor and the mech again. Both are extremely clean, lubricated and turn very easily. My auto speed unit has been re capped and thoroughly checked out, if there is anything bad in there, I don't know what it is ? I re mounted the motor, put a new bottom support plug in, nothing is sagging or dragging. The LPC1 still plays slow on 45's, slower than 33 1/3 speed. I removed the motor again to do a test. With the motor removed and uncoupled it runs fine and at the proper RPM for both 33 1/3 and 45's. At 33 1/3 RPM it is quite difficult to "stall" the motor by applying resistance to the shaft. At 45 RPM with the auto speed unit engaged it is much much easier to stall the motor, maybe half the effort or friction is required to stall it. I could be wrong, but from what I have read on the internet and experienced it seems to me that everything must be almost perfect for this auto speed unit to supply enough torque to this motor at 80 Hz to run the mech at 45 record speed. If it is a little bit cold, say below 65 or 70, like it is in NY now, forget it ! 33 1/3 will play, 45's will not, unless I warm things up first. So that is where I am. I would still like to change the gears if I come across a set. It seems like this will always be an issue ? Maybe the auto speed unit just should have been designed for more output ? I picked up a 222 the other day that is so dirty and gummed up and hasn't been lubricated in years and I was able to get it to play a 45 with no speed issue ? If anyone has some older 45 gears let me know please. Victory glass wants too much for a set.

Thanks,
Mark