Newcomb mv30 conversion

Hi,
I have a Newcomb mv30. It's one of those portable type record players. Here's a link for reference:
http://www.worthpoint.com/worthopedia/v ... e-61573560

It works very well overall - but the one issue I have is that the needle skips and slides A LOT on newer records.
I've talked to different people and done a lot or research and it seems like the general consensus is that these older models, with the ceramic cartridges, are really hard on the records and most of them have similar issues when playing newer records. So my real question is:

Is it possible to modify this ceramic cartridge style unit to have a magnetic cartridge & what how difficult would that be? I know it will require the addition of a preamp too. I don't have too much experience with electronics/wiring etc. so I really don't know what the implications of this type of mod -- but I would love to give this a shot if it's possible. Any information, thoughts or ideas would be much appreciated!!

thanks!
-eric

Just replace the needle...why would you want to modify something like that? You're wasting you money. I've had a few of those "classroom" record players in the past...Califone, Rheem, VM, etc., and still have one --BB


Bobby Basham
Tucson, Arizona

Those players are horrible... period.
Cheap tonearms and clunky noisy motors... designed for old mono records to be played in schools, not finer listening.
Anyone remember doing jumping jacks to that "Chicken Fat" song they played in the gym by Forrest Preston?

Ha! You said "Chicken Fat" The only thing these players had was a reasonably powerful amp.. They were basiclly a super-heavyduty kiddie-phono. Most of them had those power-point cartridges in them. You can get replacement stylus/carts for them but I wouldn't use it for anything but my old worn out 78s and LPs. I have one just so I can say I have one. I have yet use it. As for ceramic carts being hard on records: Magnetic carts are generally better but a decent turntable with a decent ceramic cartridge is not necessarily destructive to records.

Indeed Thom, those amps had to belt out Chicken Fat among other school audio learning material over a large area, (gym, auditorium) sometimes with noisy kids.

But those Power-pont cartridges were meant for only lateral-cut mono records.
They have absolutely no vertical compliance, unlike a stereo cartridge does.

thanks guys -
yeah i've tried a couple new cartridges on this and the skipping and sliding is persistent. Messing with the tone-arm settings doesn't help either.
It really just seems as if the needle isnt fine enough for some of the newer records and then it just sort of slides all over.
I like the way these things look and I like that theyre self-contained, that's sort of why I was hoping to modify it vs. buying something new.

To be fair the sliding and skipping you mention isn't normal, even for them. Something is wrong. Make sure you are using the correct stylus ie: LP for Lps 33 1/3) and 45s and 78 for 78s. An LP needle is an LP needle and will play without skipping if the turntable and tonearm are in good shape and set up properly. The turntable must be level, The stylus must be vertical to fit in the groove properly. The Vertical Tracking Force must be equal to what the cartridge Mfgr recommends. The tone arm must move freely in both directions and the tonearm wires should not hinder movement at all. Check these out and let us know what you find. Also, keep your eye out for a better portable phonograph like a Magnavox, GE, Zenith, etc. Your records will thank you in the end.

Thanks Thom,

I took a good look at it last night.
Everything 'appears' to be fine. I was really interested in your comment about the stylus being vertical. I never really checked to see if maybe the cartridge mount was bent or twisted etc. I unscrewed the mount and examined it but it seems to be in good shape.
Ugh - I think I'll probably just give up on this thing at this point and maybe just look into some of those other brands you mentioned. thanks again!
eric

I don't know if you've checked this out...the but the tone arm may be twisted. I've come across a few of those. That cartridge may be mounted properly, but that tone arm could have been twisted slightly by some brat mishandling it.

I can remember back in the mid- to late- 60's in grade schools with the different classroom recordplayers. Back in 1965, we had some nice, brown VM suitcase units with automatic changers...wish I could find one of those again. Around 1968, when I was in Jr High, we had those Newcomb units. Some were the larger stereo ones that had the main unit and two separate speaker cabs that clipped together to create one unit for ease of carrying. I think they had 12" speakers and no tweeters. They were LOUD!

You may not notice it, but set the arm down at the beginning of a record and look at the front of the arm squarely to see if it's parallel to the record surface. If the entire arm is tilted inward, then that needle is riding on its inner side and is going to slide across the record. Almost like using a broom where the bristles are pointing away from the object you're sweeping.

There's nothing sophisticated about these units, so don't give up. I have an old AudioTronics Classroom Recordplayer from the early 1980s (the tag said needle was replaced in 1981), and it handles LP's okay. I wouldn't play my prized LP's on it, but I got about 3,000, some are rather beat up, but still playable.

I like putting my ear up close to that 5x7 or 6x9 oval speaker to hear it. What a nice sound from a small tube amp and full range. I can hear even the deepest bass notes, even though they may not project throughout the room, but there's still a hint of the bass. I think mine has one 12AX7 tube and has a plug for headset. I don't think that pot is padded because it will drive speaker at full volume. It will hurt your ears. --BB


Bobby Basham
Tucson, Arizona

Hi Bob,
thanks! I am away from my house right now but will check out the tone arm when I get back tomorrow.
-eric

Hi Bob,
The tonearm itself appears to be in good shape, nothing bent or twisted. My tonearm tension/resistance can be adjusted with a little spring attached to variously spaced 'tabs'. I have tried every setting but this never really fixes the problem either.
I was wondering, have you played any newer records on yours? How do they play, any skipping or sliding? For me, records from the 50's 60's and 70's work fine. It's not until I play records from 80's + that I start getting the skipping and sliding. That is actually the reason I sort of thought the problem was with the needle/stylus/cartridge - it will play the old stuff great but then you throw a newer record on the turntable and it just skips and slides all over. Actually to be completely clear, it will play the newer records a little bit here and there but it skips and slides the majority of the time. But yea, only on the newer records.
Thanks again! If you have any ideas let me know.
-eric

Ideas?..... sure!

Chuck the thing in the landfill and get something you CAN play newer records on.

The player's not MEANT to play anything BUT older records.... it's the DESIGN, period..... you can't make something do what it wasn't designed to do.
You'd have a better chance playing records with a rock.

I disagree with you, MattTech.

I fired up my old classroom record player just a few minutes ago on the kitchen counter (with a tired needle), playing a Long-playing, micro-groove stereo recording of a Mozart Concerto for Three Pianos and Orchestra. It played it with no problems.

What do you mean by "older" records? If that means since my little record player was built in the 70's or or early 80's, do I need to play records from the 40's or 50's?

I don't know what planet you're from, but get a grip. These things can play LP's. I can't remember any of my teachers back in the early 60's bringing out some big ole thick 78's and playing them in the classroom. They were playing LP's. Stereo came out around 1957, and I'm sure these units sported that they could play them. That's why they had the dual needles for 33/45 and for 78 rpm. Even some of the LP's were marked "suitable for stereo or mono". We're not talking about old Victrolas and steel needles here.

Our old Astro-Sonics are from the 60's and they handle LP's well. What makes you think that these classroom record players couldn't handle LP's to bring the joy of music to the classroom?

Eric, the little spring you described, I believe, is for stylus pressure. These units do not have an anti-skating adjustment. Take a good look at that arm again and make sure your cartridge wires are loose underneath and not adding unnecessary pressure to the lateral tonearm movement.--BB


Bobby Basham
Tucson, Arizona

Ahem,.... the "Planet" I'm from,... recognizes the difference in design and requirements of various electronic components.
As well as the limitations designed into each one.

Classroom players were meant for a certain use.... period.
Not for highfidelity, or even casual home use.... classroom enviornments.

Heavy-duty design, ruggedness, and reliability, that's all.

People wanting to play records at home, and particularly not wanting to damage them from wear, should take note and use a player designed with such in mind.... not wasting their time trying to make a diamond out of a rock.

I want to educate people of such things, since most people haven't a clue.
"If it turns and spins a record and makes sounds, I can use it" is NOT a viable argument.

There's no need to bash me.... I know quite a lot more than you or most on here and speak without mincing words. I talk "straight up".

I'm not some tinkerer or hobbyist putzing with these things you know..... I'm an experienced and highly qualified technician in the field of servicing/electronics, and my customers admire the fact that I'm able to guide them towards the proper results, as well as make sure their equipment is functioning to the best ability it can after I'm though servicing it.

But I won't encourage someone to use or even waste time on a "classroom player" with all its faults and crudeness, because it'll only frustrate them in the end.

Thanks Bobby (and others),
your optimism kept me thinking - and I'm glad it did!
One of the first things I did when I bought this unit was to remove the cartridge and buy a replacement. When I noticed the skipping and sliding I bought another, figuring the first was faulty. Although these were the correct replacements, the skipping and sliding on newer records occurred with both! of these cartridges.
It never dawned on me until last night to throw the old cartridge in and give it a try. I'm really glad I held onto that cartridge because when I did it played the newer records perfectly!

MattTech I can appreciate your desire to inform and educate, very commendable -- unfortunately, for what it's worth, your delivery isn't conducive to receptivity.