Rockola 461

Hello,

I recently picked up a non-working rockola 461 for cheap and was able to get it working fairly easily , I thinks that grab arm was in a bind from being transported on its back by previous owner.

My goal for this is to be a usable jukebox that I would not be embarrassed to have in my house. It came very dirty and I think that a family of mice used it as a home for a long time.

Like I said it is working now and it sounds ok, and I have lubed the areas I can see obviously need it but I am worried about oiling where I should not.

I can see I will have to make some repairs to the cabinet (water damage on the base) and will have to remove everything from it to do that easier.

So I my questions are should I dissemble the mechanism to clean it or can I do an adequate job cleaning while it is still assembled? While searching this machine and other Rockola's I have seen mention of a lubrication guide but I can not find a copy of it anywhere, I have the manuals but it does not include this information or any user guide type info at all really.
With the sound system will it require any servicing such as recapping or should I just leave it alone because it it currently working?

My main worry is that I am going to take a working jukebox and turn it into a non-working jukebox .

Thanks for your help,

Shawn

Here is a link to the mec working: https://youtu.be/cDyLesDa6gs (I have cleaned contacts on read-out arm so it does not shutter when returning home any longer)

I took out center plastic section so that the internals would be visible.

Hi
Advice on lubrication will be available if you search the forum and also markmail.org. If the gripper assembly is operating free you may get away with just lubricating rather than dismantling it . The assembly is tedious enough to assemble again. The amp would need recapping as the caps are probably more than 40 years old and some resistors are probably out of tolerance, but if it sounds ok to you its really up to yourself
clones

Do I need to remove the old dried on oil with some form of degreaser like gum out before re-oiling everything?

Thanks,

Shawn

Yes old gummed up grease needs to be removed. To get at it all you would need to disassemble the gripper assembly
Clones

well I have started the disassembly so wish me luck!

Did Rockola put out an users manual for this jukebox, I can not seem to find even a reference to one anywhere.

I have the service and parts manual but a users manual would be very helpful.

Thanks again,

Shawn

Ok, so I am almost done with my restore but while inspecting the speakers I managed to put my thumb thru one of the woofer cones .

I am now looking for a replacement set, what should I look for as far as pairing them with the amp?

The amp is the Monaural 50335-A.

Thanks in advance!!!

Shawn

According to this schematic: http://arcarc.xmission.com/PDF_Jukebox/ ... 461-70.pdf The woofers are 8 ohm each and the midranges are 16 ohm each. The amp itself probably puts out about 25 watts rms -at best so efficiency is important.

It is somewhat true that jukebox speakers are matched to the cabinet environment they are placed in. If you want the original performance, I suggest repairing (patch or recone) the originals or search for decent originals. Most jukebox manufacturers tended to use the same speaker-amp combination for several years, so you don't necessarily have to go by that specific model.

Beyond this, if you really want to make improvements in the sound and record tracking I suggest:

-Adding a counterweight to the tonearm to greatly improve tracking and allow lower tracking weight and allow a better stylus to be used. the existing cart can be used with several types of stylus.

-Adding at least one horn loaded tweeter.

-Adding a crossover to get the highs out of the woofers. A simple two-way and tweeter will make a world of difference.

The amp should have it's capacitors replaced, but if it is not idling hot it is at least safe to use it.

--Be sure to check ALL fuses for correct values and make sure any circuit breakers have not been jumped.

Rob-NYC

Wow, that is some great advice Here is a pic of the speaker in question. Do you think it can be patched?



I will diffidently try your suggestions, do you have any tips for adding crossover and tweeter? I am not very electronic savvy yet.

Here are some pics of my progress so far.

Very easily salvaged--a tube of "Testors airplane glue", with or without, a small section of TP--and away you go--Ron Rich

Shawn, these are typical of the tweeters that I have used: http://www.pyleaudio.com/sku/PH25/3-x-3-Horn-Tweeter Given that the machine is wired mono only one is really needed.

As for crossover, here it gets a bit more complicated. I know that machine is capable of being upgraded to stereo with another P.A. module. Since the current total load represents 4 ohms for the woofers and 8 ohms for the "tweeters" -actually midranges, it might be easier to just mount simple chokes at each woofer and and a simplr capacitor on the new tweeter (they often come with one anyway). This will represent a 6db crossover and be adequate for your purposes.

This chart helps in selecting components:
http://www.parts-express.com/resources- ... tion-guide

in the past I used an approx 1.1 mH choke on 8 ohm speakers with good results. The 1.27 or 1.87 would give similar results. The idea is to get the highs and upper mids out of the woofers and thus avoid that 'cry" that comes from large speakers trying to cover frequencies they are not fast enough to respond to.

On the new tweeter, I suggest the cap be approx 8-10 mfd (non polarized is best here) to minimize overlap with the woofer and provide a slight dip @1khz region. These caps are cheap and you can easily experiment to find values that give a pleasant sound.

How/where you mount these components is a matter of convenience. Given that the tweeter is new it should be easy to mount the cap adjacent to it with one cap terminal on the speaker terminal and the other crimped or soldered to a spade lug or terminal strip.

The chokes are a bit more weighty and large so they can be either mounted to the speaker frames or on a terminal strip. It depends on what suits you and how the wiring harness is routed.

The existing tweeters and caps can remain.

One point: I added a horn tweeter to a 432 (R-0) and it was a bit tricky to find a space for it that would not conflict or touch the mech so look before you cut a hole.

Rob-NYC

Ok, so I pretty much have it back together and it it working perfectly except it will not play side B at all, the write in arm moves into position and then nothing I can hear relays clicking and it subtracts credit but the coil does not fire and from what I can tell it is not getting any power. The read-out arm will cycle once and then go back home. I have cleaned every relay and contact and check every fuse i could find. I don't know where to go from here so any help will be very much appreciated.

Success!!

So I re-cleaned the wire bundle connectors and low and behold it works now!!

Finally got it done, I could not be happier!!!
I can switch out the pictures, change the look, It is located at an airport right now so that is why all the pics are aviation related.

Thank you everyone for your help!!!
Rob-NYC, I plan on doing some or all of you recommendations when I get a chance, thanks again!

Are you operating this in public ? If so, you need a license from the Jukebox Licensing Office, located in the ASCAP building in Nashville TN., or you risk HEFTY fines--Ron Rich

Not operating for profit, I have cash door off and a stack of quarters for people to recycle through.

When I say airport I don't mean a passenger terminal rather I have it in the back room on the FBO I work at.

We deal with aircraft owners, hangar bums, and the private jet type.