Seeburg B Selection problem

Hi

I have replaced the latch bar solenoid, adjusted the snap switch and put everything back in the cabinet. Now selector keys J & K 1-10 will not move the pinbank pins and no selection is made. All other keys will move the pinbank pins and a selection will play.

If I move the pinbank levers manually the mech will respond and play the record. According to the trouble shooting guide it would appear that I need to repair or replace the group coil.

Any other ideas on what I may need to check or do before I proceed?

Best
Darrell

Hi Darrell,
Yep--- I have "another idea" -- if that group coil worked before, check the plugs between the SAU and ES-- Plug them together rather then into the WSR and test that way--if it now works, plug them back in normally, and it will probably be OK. If not check for a broken wire, or a problem in the ES -- Ron Rich
PS--Group coil measures about 4 ohms, if good--

Hi Ron

Plugged Jones plus together and nothing, so I guess its back to the selector for the problem. With the selector out of the cabinet everything worked fine. Back in the cabinet and J &K 1-10 do not work.

Best
Darrell

Checked ES and could not find any broken wires. Used Deoxit on slides and wire connections as well as on Jones plugs. Now sometimes (20% of the time or less) a selection in the J-K 1-10 range will work. Headway but problem still there.

Best
Darrell

Hi Darrell,
Didja clean the ES first ??--Remove latch sol/ counter sol (if still there). WASH- ES switches in hot soapy water ( I like to use ammonia--soapy kind, when I can find it)--then rinse totally--dry totally then a very, very, small amount of Deoxit, on each slide--do not get any type of spray "contact cleaner" on the brown wafer portions of the switch ! Usually that "fizzes it" ! Ron Rich

Hi Ron

Before I clean with soapy water, I see the A ES is E5 while the B ES is E6, Is there any reason why I could not hook the B es to the A juke box for test purposes? If grime is the problem then it should react the same in the A. If it worKs OK there I would know that the problem lies somewhere else, possibly dirty pin bank?

Best
Darrell

Hi Darrel,
Yep--one may do that--Those are electrically identical, except the A had no provisions for a total selection made, meter.
Pin bank coil is EZier to check--real fast ! ?? Ron Rich

Ron

ES works fine connected to the A. Problem has to be somewhere else. How does one "Pin bank coil is EZier to check--real fast ! ?? "?

I am thinking that the pinbank is dirty inside and not allowing pins to move????

Best
Darrell

Darrell,
I had assumed that you checked th group relay contacts and found that an A or B did not actuate that coil ?? That' s what you inferred on the1st post ?? Real quick check is (with power off) read from the coil connection on the side of the SAU to ground--My re-memor-y-er says it should be about 6 ohms ?? Check a couple to be sure I am correct ! Also--you can watch that particular relay when you have someone push in a selection--izit moooving ??
SURE--all the pins can be frozen--'specially if "someone" sprayed "something", in there !! Ron Rich

Hi Ron

Sorry for any confusion. I was going by the trouble shooting guide, page 45 (k) open group coil and (l) Open circuit to group coil.

I get a reading of 5.6 OHMs.

If the pins are failing to move account of crud, would Deoxit be okay to use or is Deoxit "can be frozen--'specially if "someone" sprayed "something", in there" one of those things that should not be sprayed in there?

Best
Darrell

Hi Darrell,
Iffin you read 5.6 ohms, I'd say the coil is OK !
NO--Deoxit, or anything else, IMHO, should never be "sprayed" into a SA Unit ! It MUST be dis-assembled and done correctly, to have any chance of operating for any length of time. Ron Rich

Ron

Is lacquer thinner an acceptable cleaner to get the black crud off the washers and other parts?

Best
Darrell

Darrell,
I dono--I have never used it-- Ron Rich

Ron

Do not use lacquer thinner, it does not remove this black stuff. What do you use? I am thinking that Tarnex metal cleaner may be a good product to try?

Best
Darrell

Hi Darrell,
I am sorry, but I am prohibited from giving advice on the subject of SA Units. I made an agreement years ago, that I would not divulge the method "invented"-used by a gentleman I know, as he does it commercially. He has a "total routine" ( which includes a "specialized CAD tool"), that he shared with me on condition that I never share it with anyone else, unless he either quit, or passed away. Ron Rich